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Thank you everyone for tuning

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into today's Fireside Chat.

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We have a very special program for you today.

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I am Steven Berk, Group Director for

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the Trademark Law Offices at the United

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States Patent and Trademark Office,

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and it is my pleasure to introduce

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our host and guest today.

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First is Commissioner for

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Trademarks, Dave Gooder, a long time

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IP Attorney and trademark practitioner

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who took the helm of of the

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Trademark Office a year ago March.

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Dave is leading the Trademark Office

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during a period of a large increase in

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the volume of trademark applications

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due to the growth of e-commerce,

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the desire of many Americans to start their

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own companies and launch new products,

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and the rapid globalization of brands,

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among other factors.

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He is also overseeing the adoption of what

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some have called the most significant

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trademark legislation of the past 75 years,

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that being the Trademark

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Modernization Act of 2020.

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Suffice it to say,

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Dave is a very busy person

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and we thank him for his time today.

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He is joined by Dana Jozefczyk,

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who became Associate General Counsel

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for the intellectual Property

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for the US Olympic and Paralympic

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Committee in September 2019.

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Dana was previously a partner at Merchant

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& Gould Trademark Group in Denver, CO,

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and at the US Olympic and

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Paralympic Committee,

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Dana's focus is on brand

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protection and enforcement.

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And Dana,

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I imagine you are as equally busy as Dave

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because of the Summer Olympics coming up.

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So again,

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So, like Dave,

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we thank you very much for your time today.

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And like everybody out there,

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I think we're very excited to have

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our athletes going to Tokyo this year,

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joining the ranks of past

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notables such as Jesse Owens,

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Muhammad Ali, Mary Lou Retton,

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Sugar Ray Leonard,

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just to name a few.

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Our athletes will be competing in

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various sports such as track and field,

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swimming, gymnastics

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and the list goes on and on.

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Each of these sports and others

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are supported by their own

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brands and through trademarks,

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and I would note many of these

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activities such as extreme sports,

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are growing and catching on like

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wildfire. At the Trademark Office,

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we recognize the importance of

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all sports and recreation brands

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to the US economy.

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In fact,

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we will soon be launching a new

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trademarks and sports initiative aimed

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at educating the public about the

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importance of sports brands and trademarks.

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We hope to inspire more Americans

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to become engaged in the many

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facets of the fast growing sports

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and recreation economy.

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So please be on the lookout

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for that in the coming months.

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OK, time permitting,

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we will take questions,

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question and answer session at the end.

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So before I hand things over, the mailbox

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addressed for you to submit questions is

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OCCOfeedback@uspto.gov.

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Let me repeat that again.

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It is OCCOfeedback@uspto.gov and we

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will try to catch as many questions

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as we can at the end. With that it is

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my pleasure to turn it over to Dave

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and Dana. Thank you both and we look

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forward to your insights in conversation.

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Thank you. Thanks, Steve,

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very much. Dana, welcome.

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It's great to see you

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as we're all doing these things.

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Welcome and

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thanks for taking the time to do this.

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Absolutely, thank you so much,

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Commissioner Gooder, this is a pleasure.

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Please call me Dave.

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Commissioner Gooder always sounds like my dad.

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We've been over that before, I just always forget.

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So one thing I always love finding

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out about people who are doing

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interesting things is how,

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what's the path you traveled

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to get to where you are?

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I mean, I know you were in private practice,

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but what got you to the USOPC

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and doing what you do now?

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Sure, happy to talk about that.

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So. I grew up in upstate New York.

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I grew up playing, you know, sports,

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volleyball, softball, soccer.

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I was not a stellar athlete by any means,

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but I enjoyed playing sports and I loved

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every two years when the Olympics came on.

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I loved watching with my family.

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I loved watching with my friends.

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Being around the world of

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sports and participating in sports

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was definitely something that I feel

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like was a forging element in my life

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growing up. After I graduated high school

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I went to school in Boston.

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I went to undergrad at Boston College

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and when I first matriculated at BC,

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I thought I wanted to pursue a pre-med path.

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So I did all the things that you do

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your freshman and sophomore year,

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when you're looking to be pre-med.

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I came to the realization at some

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point at the end of my sophomore year

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that the pre-med path was not for me.

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However,

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by this time I had already engaged in

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a number of science courses, as well

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a number of math courses and

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the combination of the two of them

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actually led me into the world of

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computer programming and bioinformatics.

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So kind of programming genes and

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proteins and that stuff,

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so all of this put together during

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undergrad weirdly piques my interest

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in patent law.

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I thought to myself that you know

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technology and science and being

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able to approach it from a legal

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perspective would be a fascinating career

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path, so I ended up at CU Boulder.

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That's where I went to law school.

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I had an uncle who lives in the Denver

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area at the time and Boulder is a

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gorgeous place to spend a couple of years.

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So I went to law school there

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and when I was at CU,

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I started interning at a law firm, Merchant

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and Gould. It's a Minneapolis based law firm,

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but it's an intellectual property boutique.

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So when I started my career at Merchant,

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I focused on patent law, very

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very heavy in the computer software space.

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And I spent about the first four to

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five years in my career doing patent law.

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At some point during that time,

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I realized that I was not a patent lawyer.

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I didn't want to be a patent lawyer.

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I wanted to do something else,

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but my mindset at the time was very myopic.

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I remember thinking to myself,

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oh my gosh,

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if I'm not going to be a patent lawyer,

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can I still do law?

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In retrospect it was

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a very strange way to think.

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That being said,

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my managing partner at Merchant at the

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time, he was not quite

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as short sighted and he kind of encouraged

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me to join our trademark group

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which was based out of Minneapolis.

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You know this was all pre COVID.

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This is before remote work

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kind of became the norm.

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So having the Minneapolis, the trademark group

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based in Minneapolis and me being in Denver,

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it did take a little bit on

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my part to go back and forth.

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I started flying out to Minneapolis,

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meeting the folks there, becoming

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part of that team. On my side,

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they really mentored me,

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took me under their wing, taught me

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trademark law enforcement brand protection,

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all the things that I would

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actually end up doing as a career.

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So I worked in that trademark group

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out of the Denver office for I think

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about five or six years.

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I'm not sure about that exactly,

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but really had an opportunity to kind

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of build our Denver based trademark group,

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which was an incredible

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chance in my life.

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We got to focus on Denver based clients,

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building our Denver based trademark practice,

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and thinking about how we wanted

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to approach brand strategy through

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our Denver office, which was great.

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About a year before

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I took the job at USOPC,

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I saw my general counsel speak

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at a sports law forum.

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I think it was at the Rocky

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Mountain IP Institute actually,

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and I remember thinking to myself,

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gosh,

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that would be such a neat job,

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if I could get that IP job at

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USOPC, that would be really cool.

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Lo and behold,

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a year later it came up and I ended up here.

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That's a great path.

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I remember when that job got posted and

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a lot of people looked at it and said,

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wow, what a fabulous job and in

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a great place to live and and so

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you obviously dazzled everybody

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because you're here

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so that's great,

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Is there,

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if you look back at all these

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things that you did before,

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if you had to pick out

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one thing that really has

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impacted how you do your work now,

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what what would it be?

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Do you think?

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Yeah,

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that's a good question.

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So I actually think the thing that

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impacts most, if none of the things that

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I just spoke about throughout my life.

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Despite picking a communications

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based career,

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I've always struggled with teaching others.

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I've had a hard time kind of

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verbalizing my thought process,

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so I'd never been able to tutor

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other people or kind of explain the

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way I was reasoning or thinking.

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This is not a great asset for a lawyer,

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by the way.

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And at some time when I was

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working at Merchant,

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I had the opportunity to teach at CUI.

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t wasn't a full time professor, it was,

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it was a

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kind of

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I guess I was a guest teacher

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for a couple of classes and that

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kind of gave me

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the opportunity to practice more

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this educational approach.

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A better way of explaining myself, a better

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way of communicating the way I'm thinking,

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especially to law students,

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folks who were not kind of as like deep

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in the trademark IP space at that time,

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but we're trying to figure out

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what path of law they'd like to pursue and

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where they would like their life to go.

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So I've always been really,

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really grateful for my

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opportunity to teach it to you,

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in large part because I help,

280
00:08:52,510 --> 00:08:54,758
I think that helped me become someone who

281
00:08:54,758 --> 00:08:57,008
can better explain where I'm coming from.

282
00:08:57,010 --> 00:08:58,510
Better explain the why behind,

283
00:08:58,510 --> 00:09:01,120
you know what we're doing and why

284
00:09:01,120 --> 00:09:03,610
we're acting in the way that we're acting.

285
00:09:03,610 --> 00:09:06,328
And a lot of what my current role is

286
00:09:06,328 --> 00:09:09,010
right now is we do a lot of education.

287
00:09:09,010 --> 00:09:10,590
There's a lot of communication

288
00:09:10,590 --> 00:09:11,854
about our enforcement strategy.

289
00:09:11,860 --> 00:09:13,996
The way that we approach our brands and

290
00:09:13,996 --> 00:09:15,893
the reasoning behind you know the way

291
00:09:15,893 --> 00:09:17,909
that we take certain actions that we take.

292
00:09:17,910 --> 00:09:19,702
And so I do feel like my time

293
00:09:19,702 --> 00:09:20,989
teaching helped me develop some

294
00:09:20,989 --> 00:09:22,567
skills where I could actually talk

295
00:09:22,567 --> 00:09:24,477
to people and have them understand,

296
00:09:24,480 --> 00:09:27,066
you know, kind of the why.

297
00:09:27,070 --> 00:09:28,942
And have the people shooting questions

298
00:09:28,942 --> 00:09:31,239
back at you and things like that.

299
00:09:31,240 --> 00:09:32,308
Keeping you challenged.

300
00:09:32,308 --> 00:09:34,592
Well, OK, so speaking of enforcement,

301
00:09:34,592 --> 00:09:37,344
you've got a fairly big challenge coming

302
00:09:37,344 --> 00:09:39,920
up this summer. The Tokyo Games

303
00:09:39,920 --> 00:09:42,246
are what, a little over a month away?

304
00:09:42,250 --> 00:09:45,176
An no doubt you and your team

305
00:09:45,176 --> 00:09:47,769
are gearing up for all that.

306
00:09:47,770 --> 00:09:52,153
Tell us a little bit about your approach to

307
00:09:52,160 --> 00:09:53,680
brand protection, brand enforcement

308
00:09:53,680 --> 00:09:55,960
in and around the Olympic Games.=

309
00:09:55,960 --> 00:09:59,020
I=an the Paralympic Games.

310
00:09:59,020 --> 00:10:00,550
Yeah so

311
00:10:00,550 --> 00:10:02,500
our approach really is highly focused,

312
00:10:02,500 --> 00:10:04,609
as I just mentioned, on education.

313
00:10:04,610 --> 00:10:06,978
One thing that a lot of folks are

314
00:10:06,978 --> 00:10:09,522
not aware of is that the USOPC

315
00:10:09,522 --> 00:10:11,022
is a nonprofit organization.

316
00:10:11,030 --> 00:10:13,058
We do not receive taxpayer funding.

317
00:10:13,060 --> 00:10:14,750
We don't receive government assistance.

318
00:10:14,750 --> 00:10:17,137
We are an organization that relies on

319
00:10:17,137 --> 00:10:19,491
our sponsors and our fundraising to

320
00:10:19,491 --> 00:10:21,840
send Team USA athletes to the games.

321
00:10:21,840 --> 00:10:24,160
So this is something that a lot of

322
00:10:24,160 --> 00:10:26,586
people are not aware of and it's

323
00:10:26,586 --> 00:10:28,361
something again in my educational

324
00:10:28,428 --> 00:10:29,848
approach to brand enforcement

325
00:10:29,848 --> 00:10:32,349
that I like to explain to folks.

326
00:10:32,349 --> 00:10:34,932
Because of the way that we're structured,

327
00:10:34,932 --> 00:10:36,890
because we're a nonprofit entity,

328
00:10:36,890 --> 00:10:39,114
Congress set us up in a manner whereby

329
00:10:39,114 --> 00:10:41,433
we have exclusive rights to certain

330
00:10:41,433 --> 00:10:43,553
intellectual property and the statute

331
00:10:43,553 --> 00:10:45,831
that set us up in this capacity is a

332
00:10:45,831 --> 00:10:48,146
is an act called the Ted Stevens Act.

333
00:10:48,150 --> 00:10:48,465
Well,

334
00:10:48,465 --> 00:10:50,355
it's actually called the Ted Stevens

335
00:10:50,355 --> 00:10:51,909
Olympic and Amateur Sports Act.

336
00:10:51,910 --> 00:10:54,206
I'm going to shorthand that David

337
00:10:54,206 --> 00:10:56,110
for this conversation. I'm just gonna

338
00:10:56,110 --> 00:10:58,130
call the Ted Stevens Act, no problem.

339
00:10:58,130 --> 00:11:00,195
So the Ted Stevens Act recognizes the

340
00:11:00,195 --> 00:11:02,550
way that we function as an organization.

341
00:11:02,550 --> 00:11:04,170
And because we are not

342
00:11:04,170 --> 00:11:04,952
you know,

343
00:11:04,952 --> 00:11:07,298
receiving any sort of taxpayer money

344
00:11:07,300 --> 00:11:10,030
it set us up in a manner so that we

345
00:11:10,116 --> 00:11:13,188
have the exclusive right to use

346
00:11:13,188 --> 00:11:14,724
certain terms commercially

347
00:11:14,730 --> 00:11:16,685
in the United States.

348
00:11:16,685 --> 00:11:18,249
And those marks include Olympic,

349
00:11:18,250 --> 00:11:19,420
Paralympic, Paralympiad

350
00:11:19,420 --> 00:11:21,240
Olympiad, Citius, Altius, Fortius,

351
00:11:21,240 --> 00:11:23,840
Pan American and Parapan American.

352
00:11:23,840 --> 00:11:26,120
They also include the iconic

353
00:11:26,120 --> 00:11:28,400
symbols such as the Olympic

354
00:11:28,484 --> 00:11:31,009
rings and the Paralympic agitos.

355
00:11:31,010 --> 00:11:33,432
So the reason why that the structure

356
00:11:33,432 --> 00:11:35,762
is so important is by giving you

357
00:11:35,762 --> 00:11:38,381
USOPC the exclusive right to use and

358
00:11:38,381 --> 00:11:40,523
authorize others to use these marks.

359
00:11:40,530 --> 00:11:42,890
Congress enabled us to kind of have a

360
00:11:42,890 --> 00:11:44,706
very strong sponsorship and licensing

361
00:11:44,706 --> 00:11:47,022
structure whereby we can ensure to

362
00:11:47,022 --> 00:11:49,096
our sponsors and our licensees that

363
00:11:49,096 --> 00:11:51,456
they have the right to use certain

364
00:11:51,456 --> 00:11:53,634
marks in certain categories and that

365
00:11:53,634 --> 00:11:56,457
we as the USOPC will be able to

366
00:11:56,457 --> 00:11:58,629
enforce if third parties use those

367
00:11:58,629 --> 00:12:01,095
same marks in an unauthorized manner.

368
00:12:01,100 --> 00:12:03,620
So a lot of what I'm doing right now,

369
00:12:03,620 --> 00:12:05,630
Dave, is talking to folks explaining

370
00:12:05,630 --> 00:12:07,630
why were organized the way that

371
00:12:07,630 --> 00:12:09,130
we're organized and explaining the

372
00:12:09,130 --> 00:12:11,478
why behind why we reach out.

373
00:12:11,480 --> 00:12:13,214
So you really kind of almost

374
00:12:13,214 --> 00:12:15,299
got a dual view of this.

375
00:12:15,300 --> 00:12:17,644
I mean you're a brand owner,

376
00:12:17,650 --> 00:12:19,930
but you also have these sponsors

377
00:12:19,930 --> 00:12:22,538
who are kind of a special part

378
00:12:22,538 --> 00:12:26,360
of what you do as well.

379
00:12:26,360 --> 00:12:27,986
A lot of people keep happyy.

380
00:12:27,990 --> 00:12:29,340
Yeah it is, you know,

381
00:12:29,340 --> 00:12:31,300
but it's I think it's

382
00:12:31,300 --> 00:12:33,409
a great way to look at it,

383
00:12:33,410 --> 00:12:34,079
because to me,

384
00:12:34,079 --> 00:12:35,640
the way that you enforce a brand

385
00:12:35,692 --> 00:12:37,257
is really you're protecting the

386
00:12:37,257 --> 00:12:38,822
good will associated with the mark.

387
00:12:38,830 --> 00:12:40,145
And there's many ways that

388
00:12:40,145 --> 00:12:41,810
you kind of look at that.

389
00:12:41,810 --> 00:12:43,430
I mean, from the one perspective,

390
00:12:43,430 --> 00:12:45,397
you don't want a third party to

391
00:12:45,397 --> 00:12:47,292
affiliate itself with your brand in a

392
00:12:47,292 --> 00:12:49,388
way that you don't authorize, in a way

393
00:12:49,388 --> 00:12:51,020
that could cause your company harm.

394
00:12:51,020 --> 00:12:52,380
And on the other hand,

395
00:12:52,380 --> 00:12:54,030
you also don't want third parties

396
00:12:54,030 --> 00:12:55,445
to commercialize your brand and

397
00:12:55,445 --> 00:12:57,065
the fact that we have sponsor

398
00:12:57,065 --> 00:12:57,875
considerations just built

399
00:12:57,880 --> 00:13:00,960
kind of nicely into that niche at the USOPC.

400
00:13:00,960 --> 00:13:02,976
We were able to enforce our brand

401
00:13:02,976 --> 00:13:05,267
for our benefit and also to enable

402
00:13:05,267 --> 00:13:06,972
these relationships to continue so

403
00:13:06,972 --> 00:13:09,349
that we can continue to send Team USA

404
00:13:09,349 --> 00:13:11,262
athletes to the games, train them,

405
00:13:11,262 --> 00:13:13,740
feed them, all of that stuff that

406
00:13:13,817 --> 00:13:16,457
enables us to have a very strong team.

407
00:13:16,460 --> 00:13:20,364
Yeah. So like a number of brands,

408
00:13:20,370 --> 00:13:23,434
it seems to me that

409
00:13:23,440 --> 00:13:24,968
you all have fans,

410
00:13:24,968 --> 00:13:26,878
and fans can become infringers,

411
00:13:26,880 --> 00:13:28,800
but they're are different breed,

412
00:13:28,800 --> 00:13:31,474
and it's not like a normal ...

413
00:13:31,480 --> 00:13:34,154
What's been your approach to dealing with,

414
00:13:34,160 --> 00:13:35,273
let's call them,

415
00:13:35,273 --> 00:13:37,499
I mean some people call them unintentional

416
00:13:37,499 --> 00:13:38,759
infringers, fan infringers.

417
00:13:40,900 --> 00:13:43,564
That kind of. And because it's a great

418
00:13:43,564 --> 00:13:45,737
question and it really runs the gambit.

419
00:13:45,737 --> 00:13:48,813
On the one hand, we receive a lot of

420
00:13:48,813 --> 00:13:50,377
proactive requests, which is great.

421
00:13:50,377 --> 00:13:52,190
We have brand usage guidelines that are

422
00:13:52,240 --> 00:13:54,536
public on our website and there's an email

423
00:13:54,536 --> 00:13:56,198
address associated with those guidelines,

424
00:13:56,200 --> 00:13:58,513
and so we do receive a lot of folks

425
00:13:58,513 --> 00:14:01,078
who are trying to do the right things.

426
00:14:01,080 --> 00:14:03,376
A lot of emails from people saying hey,

427
00:14:03,380 --> 00:14:06,250
I would like to throw an event in my town.

428
00:14:06,250 --> 00:14:08,259
I'd like to sell Olympic t-shirts.

429
00:14:08,260 --> 00:14:09,100
Is this okay?

430
00:14:09,100 --> 00:14:11,060
And it gives me an opportunity to

431
00:14:11,126 --> 00:14:13,261
not only explain the why behind we

432
00:14:13,261 --> 00:14:15,297
would ask that they not do that.

433
00:14:15,300 --> 00:14:17,323
But it also kind of addresses the

434
00:14:17,323 --> 00:14:19,640
problem before it happens, which is nice.

435
00:14:19,640 --> 00:14:21,436
I mean, it's always more frustrating

436
00:14:21,436 --> 00:14:23,573
to have to deal with these things

437
00:14:23,573 --> 00:14:25,493
when they're already in the middle

438
00:14:25,493 --> 00:14:26,453
of being launched.

439
00:14:26,460 --> 00:14:28,644
So that's kind of like the first

440
00:14:28,644 --> 00:14:30,754
way that we tend to interact with

441
00:14:30,754 --> 00:14:32,970
fans as folks who are proactive.

442
00:14:32,970 --> 00:14:34,830
But there's a lot of people

443
00:14:34,830 --> 00:14:35,760
who aren't proactive.

444
00:14:35,760 --> 00:14:36,606
And frankly Dave,

445
00:14:36,606 --> 00:14:38,016
the vast majority of these

446
00:14:38,016 --> 00:14:39,479
folks aren't intending,

447
00:14:39,480 --> 00:14:41,340
they're trying to celebrate the games,

448
00:14:41,340 --> 00:14:43,383
and it's just they're doing it in a way

449
00:14:43,383 --> 00:14:45,645
that doesn't exactly work within our

450
00:14:45,645 --> 00:14:47,229
brand structure and brand guidelines.

451
00:14:47,230 --> 00:14:48,438
So we have to

452
00:14:48,438 --> 00:14:50,622
you know, work with people at that

453
00:14:50,622 --> 00:14:53,038
point to use marks or not use marks

454
00:14:53,038 --> 00:14:55,622
in a way that is kind of appropriate

455
00:14:55,622 --> 00:14:57,554
with how we utilize our brand.

456
00:14:57,554 --> 00:14:59,850
Did you find that when you talk

457
00:14:59,918 --> 00:15:01,850
to folks, companies we work with

458
00:15:01,850 --> 00:15:03,970
had a similar issue and I found

459
00:15:03,970 --> 00:15:05,768
that when we talked to people,

460
00:15:05,770 --> 00:15:07,730
oftentimes they they were, they would say,

461
00:15:07,730 --> 00:15:09,970
oh, gosh, I didn't realize

462
00:15:09,970 --> 00:15:10,502
how that was

463
00:15:10,502 --> 00:15:12,364
harmful to the brand.

464
00:15:12,364 --> 00:15:14,169
I'd never intended to do that.

465
00:15:14,170 --> 00:15:15,570
Do you get the same?

466
00:15:15,570 --> 00:15:16,176
So much of that.

467
00:15:16,176 --> 00:15:17,994
It's really common and

468
00:15:17,994 --> 00:15:19,370
the requests, they really

469
00:15:19,370 --> 00:15:20,326
span the board here.

470
00:15:20,330 --> 00:15:21,926
I mean we get requests about

471
00:15:21,926 --> 00:15:23,410
all different types of things.

472
00:15:23,410 --> 00:15:25,650
I mean one of the most common requests

473
00:15:25,650 --> 00:15:28,517
that I get is people who would like to use

474
00:15:28,520 --> 00:15:30,842
our mark or a simulation of the rings or

475
00:15:30,842 --> 00:15:33,498
a simulation of the agitos on apparel?

476
00:15:33,500 --> 00:15:34,360
Oftentimes, Dave,

477
00:15:34,360 --> 00:15:35,650
what happens is

478
00:15:35,650 --> 00:15:36,974
there's someone's birthday party

479
00:15:36,974 --> 00:15:38,960
or there's a summer camp,

480
00:15:38,960 --> 00:15:41,054
or someone knows someone who's

481
00:15:41,054 --> 00:15:43,504
going to the games and wants to make

482
00:15:43,504 --> 00:15:45,847
a line of t-shirts so their friends

483
00:15:45,847 --> 00:15:48,223
and family can support that athlete.

484
00:15:48,230 --> 00:15:50,372
So oftentimes this really does fall under

485
00:15:50,372 --> 00:15:52,858
the umbrella of fan engagement.

486
00:15:52,860 --> 00:15:55,420
So we do try to work with folks and

487
00:15:55,420 --> 00:15:57,581
have kind of clear brand guidelines

488
00:15:57,581 --> 00:16:00,702
as to what is okay with our IP and

489
00:16:00,702 --> 00:16:02,781
what we ask that you not do.

490
00:16:02,790 --> 00:16:05,303
We do ask that folks don't put

491
00:16:05,303 --> 00:16:06,640
our intellectual property on

492
00:16:06,640 --> 00:16:08,887
apparel and shirts and the reasoning behind

493
00:16:08,887 --> 00:16:11,286
this is similar to what I just explained.

494
00:16:11,290 --> 00:16:13,366
We have relationships with sponsors and

495
00:16:13,366 --> 00:16:15,331
licensees and we authorize them to

496
00:16:15,331 --> 00:16:17,179
use our marks on apparel and clothing,

497
00:16:17,180 --> 00:16:18,705
so we can't really authorize

498
00:16:18,705 --> 00:16:20,590
third parties to do the same.

499
00:16:20,590 --> 00:16:21,520
But understanding the

500
00:16:21,520 --> 00:16:23,070
why behind it does help.

501
00:16:23,070 --> 00:16:24,620
And a lot of people,

502
00:16:24,620 --> 00:16:26,480
once they hear the reasoning behind

503
00:16:26,480 --> 00:16:28,030
the no are very,

504
00:16:28,030 --> 00:16:31,088
very quick to say, okay, I had no idea,

505
00:16:31,088 --> 00:16:32,973
thanks for letting me know.

506
00:16:32,980 --> 00:16:34,750
Yeah, which is great.

507
00:16:34,750 --> 00:16:37,501
You're touching on something that I

508
00:16:37,501 --> 00:16:39,386
find really interesting and something

509
00:16:39,386 --> 00:16:41,914
that you know as I work through the

510
00:16:41,982 --> 00:16:43,992
years started to pay more attention

511
00:16:43,992 --> 00:16:47,808
to and that sort of this concept of

512
00:16:47,810 --> 00:16:49,498
the enforcement philosophy

513
00:16:49,498 --> 00:16:52,799
that you have as a brand or as

514
00:16:52,799 --> 00:16:54,875
an organization. Tell us a

515
00:16:54,875 --> 00:16:57,277
little bit about the

516
00:16:57,277 --> 00:16:59,719
philosophy you will adopt or

517
00:16:59,720 --> 00:17:02,583
how it evolves and and when you

518
00:17:02,583 --> 00:17:06,239
are in the enforcement space.

519
00:17:06,240 --> 00:17:06,634
Absolutely.

520
00:17:06,634 --> 00:17:10,180
I mean my personal theory or or thoughts on

521
00:17:10,251 --> 00:17:13,259
enforcement is that it serves a dual role.

522
00:17:13,260 --> 00:17:16,124
On the one hand, you know it does

523
00:17:16,124 --> 00:17:18,718
preserve the exclusivity of a brand,

524
00:17:18,720 --> 00:17:20,742
but oftentimes to me, how you

525
00:17:20,742 --> 00:17:23,010
enforce and how you communicate

526
00:17:23,010 --> 00:17:25,290
your messaging also says a lot

527
00:17:25,290 --> 00:17:27,690
about what your brand stands for.

528
00:17:27,690 --> 00:17:29,250
So from our side,

529
00:17:29,250 --> 00:17:30,420
as I mentioned,

530
00:17:30,420 --> 00:17:33,900
a lot of people use our marks in a way

531
00:17:33,994 --> 00:17:37,109
that they don't realize is not okay.

532
00:17:37,110 --> 00:17:38,685
But they're doing it because

533
00:17:38,685 --> 00:17:40,260
they're excited about the games.

534
00:17:40,260 --> 00:17:41,520
They're excited that their

535
00:17:41,520 --> 00:17:42,780
friend is a Paralympian.

536
00:17:42,780 --> 00:17:44,950
They're excited that the Tokyo Games are

537
00:17:44,950 --> 00:17:46,879
happening and it's out of excitement

538
00:17:46,880 --> 00:17:48,770
and it's out of fan engagement,

539
00:17:48,770 --> 00:17:50,968
so it's really a dual message.

540
00:17:50,970 --> 00:17:52,126
On the one hand,

541
00:17:52,126 --> 00:17:53,860
we really want to encourage folks

542
00:17:53,927 --> 00:17:55,873
to to keep the spirit and the

543
00:17:55,873 --> 00:17:57,498
enthusiasm for the games alive,

544
00:17:57,498 --> 00:17:59,323
to celebrate that within their

545
00:17:59,323 --> 00:18:01,050
communities and with their friends.

546
00:18:01,050 --> 00:18:02,625
But at the same time,

547
00:18:02,630 --> 00:18:04,742
we have to we have to monitor our

548
00:18:04,742 --> 00:18:07,159
brand so that it's used appropriately

549
00:18:07,160 --> 00:18:08,280
in these different capacities

550
00:18:08,280 --> 00:18:09,960
and this can

551
00:18:09,960 --> 00:18:11,544
show itself in

552
00:18:11,544 --> 00:18:13,040
so many different

553
00:18:13,040 --> 00:18:13,298
arenas, Dave.

554
00:18:13,298 --> 00:18:15,362
I get questions a lot about people who

555
00:18:15,362 --> 00:18:17,310
want to throw Olympic events who are

556
00:18:17,310 --> 00:18:19,199
working at a company and internally

557
00:18:19,200 --> 00:18:20,761
what they would like to do is

558
00:18:20,761 --> 00:18:22,832
have an Olympic themed Q2

559
00:18:22,832 --> 00:18:24,512
meeting with their marketing team.

560
00:18:24,520 --> 00:18:26,578
These are things that we try to

561
00:18:26,578 --> 00:18:28,437
work with people and we say hey,

562
00:18:28,440 --> 00:18:30,400
we understand that this is not commercial.

563
00:18:30,400 --> 00:18:31,858
We understand that you know this

564
00:18:31,858 --> 00:18:33,533
is not something that

565
00:18:33,533 --> 00:18:35,158
you're going out and selling,

566
00:18:35,160 --> 00:18:35,780
but again,

567
00:18:35,780 --> 00:18:37,640
these marks are preserved for our

568
00:18:37,640 --> 00:18:40,054
sponsors and our licensees and we have to be

569
00:18:40,060 --> 00:18:42,048
really careful how we authorize their use,

570
00:18:42,050 --> 00:18:44,066
so we just ask people to move away

571
00:18:44,066 --> 00:18:46,075
from our marks and move away from

572
00:18:46,075 --> 00:18:48,470
events which may use the brands or may

573
00:18:48,470 --> 00:18:50,563
put them on apparel or merchandise or

574
00:18:50,570 --> 00:18:52,268
promotions or any of those things.

575
00:18:52,270 --> 00:18:53,752
So it's a conversation that we

576
00:18:53,752 --> 00:18:55,680
do have and we have frequently,

577
00:18:55,680 --> 00:18:57,647
but I always try to start the

578
00:18:57,647 --> 00:18:59,087
conversation with thank you so

579
00:18:59,087 --> 00:19:00,437
much for your enthusiasm and

580
00:19:00,437 --> 00:19:02,210
support for the movement.

581
00:19:02,210 --> 00:19:04,198
Because I do believe the vast majority

582
00:19:04,198 --> 00:19:06,514
of the time, that's where these

583
00:19:06,514 --> 00:19:08,710
actions stem from.

584
00:19:08,710 --> 00:19:10,600
Yeah, it sure makes, it sets a

585
00:19:10,600 --> 00:19:12,526
different tone in an enforcement case

586
00:19:12,526 --> 00:19:14,632
when that's how you're starting it.

587
00:19:14,640 --> 00:19:15,798
So Dave, you mentioned that you

588
00:19:15,798 --> 00:19:17,064
used to have fan engagement at

589
00:19:17,064 --> 00:19:18,420
a company that you worked for.

590
00:19:18,420 --> 00:19:20,904
How did you? How did you deal with it?

591
00:19:20,910 --> 00:19:23,402
Well yeah you had people

592
00:19:23,402 --> 00:19:26,250
who were huge, loyal fans of a brand.

593
00:19:26,250 --> 00:19:29,018
I mean to the point where they would

594
00:19:29,018 --> 00:19:31,444
tattoo it on themselves and you a

595
00:19:31,444 --> 00:19:34,079
lot of times you just really,

596
00:19:34,080 --> 00:19:35,860
we realized over time that there

597
00:19:35,860 --> 00:19:38,061
were just a category of

598
00:19:38,061 --> 00:19:40,483
people who were like you said,

599
00:19:40,490 --> 00:19:42,878
fans who just didn't realize that

600
00:19:42,878 --> 00:19:45,465
what they were doing was wrong

601
00:19:45,465 --> 00:19:46,836
and they appreciated

602
00:19:46,840 --> 00:19:49,558
taking a tone with them, that was like look,

603
00:19:49,558 --> 00:19:52,321
we just need to stop it, and here's why.

604
00:19:52,321 --> 00:19:53,589
And usually they immediately

605
00:19:53,589 --> 00:19:55,599
realized it and that grew and grew.

606
00:19:55,600 --> 00:19:57,707
So to the point where we realized,

607
00:19:57,710 --> 00:20:00,290
alright, let's adopt

608
00:20:00,290 --> 00:20:01,590
enforcement policies that are

609
00:20:01,590 --> 00:20:03,540
related to that thinking by group.

610
00:20:03,540 --> 00:20:05,794
Because every group has a little bit

611
00:20:05,794 --> 00:20:08,090
of a different issue and it really,

612
00:20:08,090 --> 00:20:10,365
I mean, it seemed to really help.

613
00:20:10,370 --> 00:20:12,242
And every once in awhile you

614
00:20:12,242 --> 00:20:13,940
know those things go viral.

615
00:20:13,940 --> 00:20:16,721
And when you when you come out of it

616
00:20:16,721 --> 00:20:19,749
with people thinking more of your brand

617
00:20:19,750 --> 00:20:21,658
because of how you handled it.

618
00:20:21,660 --> 00:20:22,620
Like you say,

619
00:20:22,620 --> 00:20:23,580
it's not,

620
00:20:23,580 --> 00:20:26,052
it's not just what, it speaks loudly about

621
00:20:26,052 --> 00:20:28,675
who you are and what you're brand is,

622
00:20:28,680 --> 00:20:29,960
so you know.

623
00:20:29,960 --> 00:20:30,280
You're obviously

624
00:20:30,280 --> 00:20:32,456
doing a good job with it because I

625
00:20:32,456 --> 00:20:34,155
looked on various trademark bully

626
00:20:34,155 --> 00:20:36,339
lists and you're not on them.

627
00:20:36,340 --> 00:20:37,692
So you're obviously doing,

628
00:20:37,692 --> 00:20:40,121
walking the right line with this and

629
00:20:40,121 --> 00:20:41,836
then people are appreciating it.

630
00:20:41,840 --> 00:20:44,549
Well, I'm going to take that as a win.

631
00:20:44,550 --> 00:20:46,356
One of the things that I found

632
00:20:46,356 --> 00:20:48,563
to be really helpful in the way

633
00:20:48,563 --> 00:20:50,268
that you communicate things is,

634
00:20:50,270 --> 00:20:52,328
I mean, this is just something that

635
00:20:52,328 --> 00:20:53,580
I've found in life.

636
00:20:53,580 --> 00:20:55,085
It's really hard to communicate

637
00:20:55,085 --> 00:20:56,289
appropriate tone through email,

638
00:20:56,290 --> 00:20:57,494
especially when you're asking

639
00:20:57,494 --> 00:20:58,999
someone to stop doing something.

640
00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:00,806
Even if you don't intend to,
641
00:21:00,810 --> 00:21:02,010
you can sound angry,

642
00:21:02,010 --> 00:21:03,210
you can sound directive.

643
00:21:03,210 --> 00:21:05,930
So what I try to do is get people

644
00:21:06,013 --> 00:21:08,736
on the phone as quickly as possible.

645
00:21:08,740 --> 00:21:09,006
Typically, if I can

646
00:21:09,006 --> 00:21:11,134
get folks on the phone

647
00:21:11,134 --> 00:21:12,956
after one email exchange,

648
00:21:12,960 --> 00:21:14,640
it goes much smoother. Now that

649
00:21:14,640 --> 00:21:16,290
doesn't happen 100% of the time,

650
00:21:16,290 --> 00:21:17,910
but I've noticed that I'm batting

651
00:21:17,910 --> 00:21:19,614
better than average right now for

652
00:21:19,614 --> 00:21:21,621
getting people on the phone and having

653
00:21:21,621 --> 00:21:23,337
the result being something

654
00:21:23,337 --> 00:21:25,070
that is not only resolved quickly,

655
00:21:25,070 --> 00:21:26,810
but I feel like the person

656
00:21:26,869 --> 00:21:28,129
on the other line felt

657
00:21:28,130 --> 00:21:29,254
heard and respected because

658
00:21:29,254 --> 00:21:30,378
that's very,

659
00:21:30,380 --> 00:21:32,540
very important to us as an organization.

660
00:21:32,540 --> 00:21:34,867
We want our fans to celebrate the games,

661
00:21:34,870 --> 00:21:37,046
but we need to make sure that it's

662
00:21:37,046 --> 00:21:39,149
done in the appropriate manner.

663
00:21:39,150 --> 00:21:41,898
And you find that those people

664
00:21:41,898 --> 00:21:43,272
tend to

665
00:21:43,280 --> 00:21:44,485
tell you about all sorts

666
00:21:44,485 --> 00:21:45,208
of other infringement.

667
00:21:47,490 --> 00:21:49,645
You read my mind. Yes, that does happen,

668
00:21:49,645 --> 00:21:51,570
so there's kind of two camps

669
00:21:51,621 --> 00:21:53,613
here and I'm sure that you've seen the

670
00:21:53,613 --> 00:21:55,437
same thing in your practice as well, Dave.

671
00:21:55,440 --> 00:21:57,030
There's the first camp

672
00:21:57,030 --> 00:21:58,885
which you call someone, and you say,

673
00:21:58,885 --> 00:22:00,740
hey, we became aware of this issue.

674
00:22:00,740 --> 00:22:02,595
I don't know if you know this,

675
00:22:02,600 --> 00:22:04,190
but we own the mark Olympic

676
00:22:04,190 --> 00:22:05,750
and here's kind of how

677
00:22:05,750 --> 00:22:07,897
we're set up and the why behind it.

678
00:22:07,900 --> 00:22:09,660
So we'd ask that you know, you

679
00:22:09,660 --> 00:22:11,099
move away from this particular

680
00:22:11,099 --> 00:22:12,669
promotion or whatever it is,

681
00:22:12,670 --> 00:22:14,518
and you kind of get two answers.

682
00:22:14,520 --> 00:22:15,580
The first is, okay,

683
00:22:15,580 --> 00:22:17,435
I'm so sorry.

684
00:22:17,435 --> 00:22:18,793
And the second is, yeah

685
00:22:18,793 --> 00:22:21,430
but the guy down the road's doing it too,

686
00:22:21,430 --> 00:22:23,694
in which case you know we have the

687
00:22:23,694 --> 00:22:25,138
classic conversation of well

688
00:22:25,138 --> 00:22:26,782
just because he's doing it,

689
00:22:26,790 --> 00:22:29,319
doesn't mean that it's okay that you do it.

690
00:22:29,320 --> 00:22:31,944
But please send me what you're talking about and

691
00:22:31,944 --> 00:22:34,677
I'll look into it as well. So I get some of that.

692
00:22:34,680 --> 00:22:36,840
I also get some of when I work

693
00:22:36,840 --> 00:22:38,309
through something with someone, a

694
00:22:38,309 --> 00:22:40,037
couple of months down the line,

695
00:22:40,040 --> 00:22:41,450
sometimes people are like, hey,

696
00:22:41,450 --> 00:22:42,860
I came across these things.

697
00:22:42,860 --> 00:22:43,988
This might be problematic

698
00:22:43,988 --> 00:22:45,398
and I'm thankful for that.

699
00:22:45,400 --> 00:22:47,815
I mean, we can only handle the

700
00:22:47,815 --> 00:22:49,569
issues that we're aware of

701
00:22:49,570 --> 00:22:51,313
and it's something that we have to

702
00:22:51,313 --> 00:22:53,109
approach on a case by case basis.

703
00:22:53,110 --> 00:22:54,839
So when people send me any things

704
00:22:54,839 --> 00:22:55,900
that they're concerned about,

705
00:22:55,900 --> 00:22:56,904
sometimes it's not trademark

706
00:22:56,904 --> 00:22:57,406
infringement, Dave,

707
00:22:57,410 --> 00:22:58,710
but sometimes it is,

708
00:22:58,710 --> 00:23:01,349
and it's something that we have to handle.

709
00:23:01,350 --> 00:23:03,354
Do you find that you get athletes sending you

710
00:23:03,354 --> 00:23:05,371
things that they've seen that they

711
00:23:05,371 --> 00:23:07,249
kind of think maybe that infringes

712
00:23:07,250 --> 00:23:09,626
or does it tend to be employees or

713
00:23:09,626 --> 00:23:12,118
who tends to be one

714
00:23:12,118 --> 00:23:14,470
of your big sources of information?

715
00:23:14,470 --> 00:23:16,110
It spans the gamut.

716
00:23:16,110 --> 00:23:17,001
As I mentioned,

717
00:23:17,001 --> 00:23:19,506
we do have s legal IP email address that's

718
00:23:19,506 --> 00:23:21,684
part of our brand usage guidelines.

719
00:23:21,690 --> 00:23:23,376
So what usually ends up happening

720
00:23:23,376 --> 00:23:24,974
is people who are reviewing

721
00:23:24,974 --> 00:23:26,610
the brand usage guidelines,

722
00:23:26,610 --> 00:23:28,542
which ends up being folks who

723
00:23:28,542 --> 00:23:30,540
are trying to follow the rules.

724
00:23:30,540 --> 00:23:31,458
Because if you're

725
00:23:31,458 --> 00:23:32,988
looking up our brand guidelines,

726
00:23:32,990 --> 00:23:34,610
you're trying to do it right.

727
00:23:34,610 --> 00:23:36,507
They'll they'll send me a note asking

728
00:23:36,507 --> 00:23:37,866
about something, and I'll say,

729
00:23:37,866 --> 00:23:39,446
Oh well, no, we actually don't.

730
00:23:39,446 --> 00:23:41,292
Some people just kind of keep an

731
00:23:41,292 --> 00:23:42,726
eye out for anything that they

732
00:23:42,726 --> 00:23:44,430
perceive to be a misuse of Olympic

733
00:23:44,430 --> 00:23:45,985
properties and report it as well.

734
00:23:45,990 --> 00:23:46,538
It really,

735
00:23:46,538 --> 00:23:48,182
there are a number of different

736
00:23:48,182 --> 00:23:50,056
ways that we find out about stuff.

737
00:23:50,060 --> 00:23:51,548
Some of the other ways that

738
00:23:51,548 --> 00:23:53,185
actually tend to lead towards a

739
00:23:53,185 --> 00:23:54,665
quicker resolution are the USPTO

740
00:23:54,670 --> 00:23:56,806
actually is one of the ways that

741
00:23:56,806 --> 00:23:59,267
I find out about a lot of this stuff

742
00:23:59,270 --> 00:24:00,086
because people

743
00:24:00,086 --> 00:24:02,126
file applications for marks that

744
00:24:02,126 --> 00:24:04,066
include Olympic or Paralympic or

745
00:24:04,066 --> 00:24:06,355
a simulation of the rings and the

746
00:24:06,355 --> 00:24:07,959
USPTO will refuse an application

747
00:24:07,959 --> 00:24:10,114
if it deems that it violates

748
00:24:10,114 --> 00:24:11,450
the Ted Stevens act.

749
00:24:11,450 --> 00:24:13,460
It's kind of a statutory bar,

750
00:24:13,460 --> 00:24:15,490
Dave, because it's a use requirement

751
00:24:15,490 --> 00:24:17,130
and without our authorization,

752
00:24:17,130 --> 00:24:18,800
a third party is not

753
00:24:18,800 --> 00:24:20,470
supposed to use those marks,

754
00:24:20,470 --> 00:24:22,574
so it's a good thing at the USPTO

755
00:24:22,574 --> 00:24:25,149
to get those flags because sometimes,

756
00:24:25,150 --> 00:24:26,660
especially maybe if these conversations

757
00:24:26,660 --> 00:24:28,820
are a little bit more challenging,

758
00:24:28,820 --> 00:24:32,830
if the person on the other end of the call

759
00:24:32,830 --> 00:24:34,394
doesn't necessarily agree with

760
00:24:34,394 --> 00:24:36,349
me or whatever their perspective

761
00:24:36,349 --> 00:24:38,218
maybe to not only hear it from me,

762
00:24:38,220 --> 00:24:40,341
but then to also get a refusal

763
00:24:40,341 --> 00:24:42,799
from the USPTO sometimes kind of

764
00:24:42,799 --> 00:24:45,300
drives the point home of like okay,

765
00:24:45,300 --> 00:24:48,324
it's not just the USOPC that's saying this,

766
00:24:48,330 --> 00:24:50,357
it's the USPTO. Right.

767
00:24:50,357 --> 00:24:52,716
And I think a lot of practitioners,

768
00:24:52,716 --> 00:24:55,106
until you bump into the Ted

769
00:24:55,106 --> 00:24:56,756
Stevens Act for some reason,

770
00:24:56,760 --> 00:25:00,080
you may not know about it and so ...

771
00:25:00,080 --> 00:25:00,878
You're right that.

772
00:25:00,878 --> 00:25:01,410
I mean,

773
00:25:01,410 --> 00:25:03,265
I remember this is a little embarrassing,

774
00:25:03,270 --> 00:25:05,382
but I remember it was about two months

775
00:25:05,382 --> 00:25:07,479
before I applied for this job at my

776
00:25:07,479 --> 00:25:09,629
old firm and there was a client that

777
00:25:09,629 --> 00:25:11,516
wanted some sort of thing that could

778
00:25:11,516 --> 00:25:13,378
have been a simulation of the rings,

779
00:25:13,380 --> 00:25:14,436
and I thought, ah,

780
00:25:14,436 --> 00:25:16,338
how does Olympic IP, this is before

781
00:25:16,338 --> 00:25:18,426
the job was posted and I was like,

782
00:25:18,430 --> 00:25:20,299
oh no, that's not going to work.

783
00:25:20,300 --> 00:25:22,420
Those are not enumerated in the Act,

784
00:25:22,420 --> 00:25:24,016
nor is our Team USA brands.

785
00:25:24,020 --> 00:25:24,782
So these are

786
00:25:24,782 --> 00:25:26,306
things that are not

787
00:25:26,306 --> 00:25:28,199
covered under the Act and like every

788
00:25:28,199 --> 00:25:29,610
other trademark owner out there,

789
00:25:29,610 --> 00:25:30,894
we file federal trademark

790
00:25:30,894 --> 00:25:31,857
applications for them.

791
00:25:31,860 --> 00:25:33,515
And we pursue those marks

792
00:25:33,515 --> 00:25:34,839
through the Lanham Act.

793
00:25:34,840 --> 00:25:37,486
So we do have a number of marks that

794
00:25:37,486 --> 00:25:40,138
are covered by the Ted Stevens Act

795
00:25:40,140 --> 00:25:42,310
but we also have a number of

796
00:25:42,310 --> 00:25:44,440
marks that fall under the

797
00:25:44,440 --> 00:25:46,757
typical confines of the Lanham Act.

798
00:25:46,760 --> 00:25:49,040
So that's how we kind of go about

799
00:25:49,040 --> 00:25:50,729
securing and protecting those.

800
00:25:50,730 --> 00:25:52,882
There is a part of the Ted Stevens Act

801
00:25:52,882 --> 00:25:54,872
that includes a provision that

802
00:25:54,872 --> 00:25:57,394
authorizes the USOPC to file a

803
00:25:57,394 --> 00:25:59,329
civil lawsuit for unauthorized use

804
00:25:59,330 --> 00:25:59,676
of

805
00:25:59,676 --> 00:26:02,444
you know the enumerated terms or of

806
00:26:02,450 --> 00:26:04,458
any trademark, trade name,

807
00:26:04,458 --> 00:26:06,968
sign, symbol or insignia falsely

808
00:26:06,968 --> 00:26:08,455
representing association with

809
00:26:08,455 --> 00:26:10,730
or authorization by the IOC,

810
00:26:10,730 --> 00:26:13,646
the IPC, Pan American Sports Organization,

811
00:26:13,650 --> 00:26:15,774
or the USOPC.

812
00:26:15,774 --> 00:26:18,960
So in many ways, marks like

813
00:26:19,091 --> 00:26:22,196
Tokyo 2020 and Team USA

814
00:26:22,200 --> 00:26:24,432
are affiliated with USO PC and

815
00:26:24,432 --> 00:26:26,698
the games and are associated with us,

816
00:26:26,700 --> 00:26:28,900
so there is that part of the

817
00:26:28,900 --> 00:26:30,897
Ted Stevens Act which does provide

818
00:26:30,900 --> 00:26:32,840
that additional civil recourse.

819
00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:35,265
So you actually provide help

820
00:26:35,265 --> 00:26:37,447
on that front in the US

821
00:26:37,450 --> 00:26:40,180
even though Tokyo 2020 is

822
00:26:40,180 --> 00:26:42,748
not necessarily a mark you all ...

823
00:26:42,750 --> 00:26:44,826
That's right. That's interesting.

824
00:26:44,826 --> 00:26:49,549
So that leads me to two questions about

825
00:26:49,550 --> 00:26:51,458
interesting things about the act,

826
00:26:51,460 --> 00:26:53,296
given that there is an enormous

827
00:26:53,296 --> 00:26:55,573
part of the US that goes

828
00:26:55,573 --> 00:26:57,529
under the name of the Olympics,

829
00:26:57,530 --> 00:26:58,176
Olympic Mountains,

830
00:26:58,176 --> 00:27:01,141
and one of those is I had heard one

831
00:27:01,141 --> 00:27:03,007
time that there was a grandfathering

832
00:27:03,007 --> 00:27:05,496
in at the time the act was passed.

833
00:27:05,500 --> 00:27:09,667
Can you talk at all about that

834
00:27:09,670 --> 00:27:11,310
limitation or how

835
00:27:11,310 --> 00:27:12,279
that works? Absolutely.

836
00:27:12,279 --> 00:27:15,249
So when the Ted Stevens Act was passed,

837
00:27:15,250 --> 00:27:17,834
they included some language in there to

838
00:27:17,834 --> 00:27:20,485
grandfather in prior rights and so this doesn't,

839
00:27:20,490 --> 00:27:22,625
this doesn't kind of

840
00:27:22,625 --> 00:27:24,100
address the geographic question,

841
00:27:24,100 --> 00:27:26,620
but there's kind of two parts that are

842
00:27:26,620 --> 00:27:28,689
grandfathered in in this particular case.

843
00:27:28,690 --> 00:27:31,154
The first is pre-existing rights for folks

844
00:27:31,154 --> 00:27:34,088
who have used some of the terms that are

845
00:27:34,088 --> 00:27:36,238
delineated in the act prior to 1950.

846
00:27:36,240 --> 00:27:37,880
And what the access is

847
00:27:37,880 --> 00:27:40,016
you know people who have been

848
00:27:40,016 --> 00:27:41,440
using those specific marks

849
00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:42,367
prior to 1950

850
00:27:42,367 --> 00:27:43,912
may continue doing so pretty

851
00:27:43,912 --> 00:27:45,689
much in the same capacity,

852
00:27:45,690 --> 00:27:47,466
so you know that that definitely

853
00:27:47,466 --> 00:27:49,290
does apply in some instances,

854
00:27:49,290 --> 00:27:51,228
and there are some companies that

855
00:27:51,228 --> 00:27:53,539
fall under that grandfatherered in basis.

856
00:27:53,540 --> 00:27:55,682
The second part is the geographic

857
00:27:55,682 --> 00:27:57,790
scope of which you just mentioned.

858
00:27:57,790 --> 00:27:59,942
So in Washington state there is an area

859
00:27:59,942 --> 00:28:02,338
west of the Cascade Mountains that can

860
00:28:02,338 --> 00:28:04,660
geographically be referred to as Olympic,

861
00:28:04,660 --> 00:28:07,540
and so the act has a carve out for that

862
00:28:07,621 --> 00:28:10,218
particular region of the US as well.

863
00:28:10,220 --> 00:28:12,607
So if a mark includes the term

864
00:28:12,610 --> 00:28:14,480
Olympic and the business associated

865
00:28:14,480 --> 00:28:16,350
with the mark operates within

866
00:28:16,409 --> 00:28:17,789
the state of Washington,

867
00:28:17,790 --> 00:28:20,010
West of the Cascade Mountain range

868
00:28:20,010 --> 00:28:22,383
then the use of Olympic can be

869
00:28:22,383 --> 00:28:24,449
considered in that specific case.

870
00:28:24,450 --> 00:28:26,670
There are some limits on that

871
00:28:26,670 --> 00:28:28,150
particular geographic carve out.

872
00:28:28,150 --> 00:28:28,844
For example,

873
00:28:28,844 --> 00:28:31,273
the goods and services sold by that

874
00:28:31,273 --> 00:28:33,803
business must be within the state of

875
00:28:33,803 --> 00:28:35,683
Washington and sales, marketing, operations

876
00:28:35,683 --> 00:28:38,504
outside of the area cannot be substantial.

877
00:28:38,510 --> 00:28:40,730
So as you can probably guess,

878
00:28:40,730 --> 00:28:43,052
it's usually leaves some questions to

879
00:28:43,052 --> 00:28:45,668
people who fall into this carve out.

880
00:28:45,670 --> 00:28:46,858
Especially with regard to

881
00:28:46,858 --> 00:28:47,749
things like websites,

882
00:28:47,750 --> 00:28:49,454
things like you know,

883
00:28:49,454 --> 00:28:51,470
I'm running a business and I am

884
00:28:51,470 --> 00:28:52,840
running a local sightseeing business

885
00:28:52,840 --> 00:28:54,579
West of the Cascade Mountains,

886
00:28:54,580 --> 00:28:56,812
but we do have folks coming in from

887
00:28:56,812 --> 00:28:59,037
out of town and I'd like a website,

888
00:28:59,040 --> 00:29:00,520
because I'd like people to

889
00:29:00,520 --> 00:29:01,704
book reservations on it.

890
00:29:01,710 --> 00:29:03,845
So this is something that you know

891
00:29:03,845 --> 00:29:06,130
we do evaluate on a case by case

892
00:29:06,130 --> 00:29:08,438
basis and we really kind of look at

893
00:29:08,438 --> 00:29:10,304
whether the brunt of the activities

894
00:29:10,304 --> 00:29:12,100
are within the state of Washington,

895
00:29:12,100 --> 00:29:12,688
or really,

896
00:29:12,688 --> 00:29:14,452
whether it's a national

897
00:29:14,452 --> 00:29:15,809
company that just happens

898
00:29:15,810 --> 00:29:18,330
to be headquartered west of those

899
00:29:18,330 --> 00:29:21,189
cascades. Gotcha. So what happens though

900
00:29:21,190 --> 00:29:22,714
in a corporate transaction?

901
00:29:22,714 --> 00:29:25,000
If somebody is acquiring one of

902
00:29:25,070 --> 00:29:27,008
those grandfathered companies,

903
00:29:27,010 --> 00:29:29,370
either geographically or

904
00:29:29,370 --> 00:29:32,910
from a time period.

905
00:29:32,910 --> 00:29:34,126
How does that

906
00:29:34,126 --> 00:29:36,860
play within acquisition?

907
00:29:36,860 --> 00:29:39,332
So the act does specify a situation whereby

908
00:29:39,332 --> 00:29:42,239
if you assign your grandfathered in rights,

909
00:29:42,240 --> 00:29:44,382
your rights that existed prior to

910
00:29:44,382 --> 00:29:46,584
1950, the assignees who offer

911
00:29:46,584 --> 00:29:48,344
the same goods and services,

912
00:29:48,350 --> 00:29:49,436
and that's important,

913
00:29:49,436 --> 00:29:51,608
are also grandfathered in under the act.

914
00:29:51,608 --> 00:29:54,095
What we see sometimes is people

915
00:29:54,095 --> 00:29:55,890
changing up their business model,

916
00:29:55,890 --> 00:29:57,990
expanding the scope of the goods

917
00:29:57,990 --> 00:29:59,840
and services that they offer.

918
00:29:59,840 --> 00:30:02,060
One of the things I also

919
00:30:02,060 --> 00:30:04,229
have seen a little bit of

920
00:30:04,230 --> 00:30:06,132
is when there hasn't been an

921
00:30:06,132 --> 00:30:07,400
assignment of rights Dave,

922
00:30:07,400 --> 00:30:09,254
but rather when there's just been

923
00:30:09,254 --> 00:30:11,520
sort of a license of those rights.

924
00:30:11,520 --> 00:30:13,105
So if an entity that's

925
00:30:13,105 --> 00:30:14,690
grandfathered in has its rights,

926
00:30:14,690 --> 00:30:17,226
and let's say for example the term Olympic,

927
00:30:17,230 --> 00:30:19,078
and you know is still operating

928
00:30:19,078 --> 00:30:21,009
within the same goods and services

929
00:30:21,009 --> 00:30:22,923
that it has always operated in.

930
00:30:22,930 --> 00:30:24,485
Sometimes I've seen situations where

931
00:30:24,485 --> 00:30:26,740
that entity says to a third party,

932
00:30:26,740 --> 00:30:27,900
oh yeah it's good,

933
00:30:27,900 --> 00:30:30,065
you can just use my mark in

934
00:30:30,065 --> 00:30:31,489
this other capacity and

935
00:30:31,490 --> 00:30:32,854
that's really something

936
00:30:32,854 --> 00:30:35,240
that we do push back on and

937
00:30:35,240 --> 00:30:36,600
it has to be.

938
00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:37,960
The act authorizes an assignment,

939
00:30:37,960 --> 00:30:39,124
not not a license.

940
00:30:39,124 --> 00:30:41,624
So it's one of these things where you know

941
00:30:41,624 --> 00:30:44,489
we do look at it at a case by case basis,

942
00:30:44,490 --> 00:30:45,303
but it's, 

943
00:30:45,303 --> 00:30:46,387
it can be challenging,

944
00:30:46,390 --> 00:30:47,805
especially if people want to

945
00:30:47,805 --> 00:30:49,505
expand the business model to a

946
00:30:49,505 --> 00:30:50,903
different scope, that that may fall

947
00:30:50,903 --> 00:30:52,649
out of the grandfather clause.

948
00:30:54,690 --> 00:30:56,418
Yeah, it's such an interesting aspect

949
00:30:56,418 --> 00:30:58,511
because it's just not something that most

950
00:30:58,511 --> 00:31:00,590
people are dealing with in a transaction

951
00:31:00,649 --> 00:31:02,525
or most brand owners don't have that

952
00:31:02,525 --> 00:31:05,858
kind of situation to deal with, but

953
00:31:05,860 --> 00:31:08,044
let's turn to the word Olympian

954
00:31:08,044 --> 00:31:10,739
and kind of the people,

955
00:31:10,740 --> 00:31:13,668
an Olympian, someone who competes and

956
00:31:13,668 --> 00:31:17,110
is that covered by the act as well?

957
00:31:17,110 --> 00:31:19,546
So the act does cover, you know,

958
00:31:19,546 --> 00:31:20,938
simulations of certain marks,

959
00:31:20,940 --> 00:31:23,028
olympion in and of itself is

960
00:31:23,028 --> 00:31:25,109
not called out by the ac.

961
00:31:25,110 --> 00:31:27,546
Olympian is a simulation of Olympic though,

962
00:31:27,550 --> 00:31:30,030
so we do use the Ted Stevens Act

963
00:31:30,030 --> 00:31:32,418
with regard to that particular term.

964
00:31:32,420 --> 00:31:34,751
But you sort of just identified the

965
00:31:34,751 --> 00:31:36,949
balance here with the term Olympian.

966
00:31:36,950 --> 00:31:39,026
It is on the one hand,

967
00:31:39,030 --> 00:31:41,118
if it's used as a brand,

968
00:31:41,120 --> 00:31:43,904
if it's used in a commercial entity,

969
00:31:43,910 --> 00:31:46,220
it could be something that may

970
00:31:46,220 --> 00:31:48,849
infringe on the rights of the USOPC.

971
00:31:48,850 --> 00:31:50,190
But on the other hand,

972
00:31:50,190 --> 00:31:52,326
if it's being used to describe a person,

973
00:31:52,330 --> 00:31:54,206
that description could very well be in

974
00:31:54,206 --> 00:31:57,440
a biographical manner, that's factual.

975
00:31:57,440 --> 00:32:00,128
So we try to strike a balancing

976
00:32:00,128 --> 00:32:00,896
approach here.

977
00:32:00,900 --> 00:32:02,810
For athletes that are Olympians

978
00:32:02,810 --> 00:32:03,574
or Paralympians,

979
00:32:03,580 --> 00:32:06,332
if they refer to themselves in a factual

980
00:32:06,332 --> 00:32:08,958
manner as an Olympian or Paralympian,

981
00:32:08,960 --> 00:32:10,870
we ask that that reference

982
00:32:10,870 --> 00:32:13,180
be made in a balanced way.

983
00:32:13,180 --> 00:32:13,878
So what

984
00:32:13,878 --> 00:32:16,321
that kind of means is other achievements

985
00:32:16,321 --> 00:32:18,560
or other accolades are listed.

986
00:32:18,560 --> 00:32:19,649
So, for example,

987
00:32:19,649 --> 00:32:21,464
this athlete in question could

988
00:32:21,464 --> 00:32:23,170
say Olympian, world champion,

989
00:32:23,170 --> 00:32:24,337
mother of three,

990
00:32:24,337 --> 00:32:26,282
or something along those lines

991
00:32:26,282 --> 00:32:28,629
that talk more about the person.

992
00:32:28,630 --> 00:32:31,240
And so that particular promotional use

993
00:32:31,240 --> 00:32:34,142
is not something that feels like it's

994
00:32:34,142 --> 00:32:37,120
trading off of Olympic IP quite as much.

995
00:32:37,120 --> 00:32:39,270
It's almost kind of a

996
00:32:39,270 --> 00:32:41,706
thinking along, it's sort of a fair

997
00:32:41,706 --> 00:32:44,490
use way of somebody who says yes,

998
00:32:44,490 --> 00:32:46,728
I worked for so and so,

999
00:32:46,730 --> 00:32:48,962
it's factually accurate.

1000
00:32:48,962 --> 00:32:50,636
So does it ...

1001
00:32:50,640 --> 00:32:52,932
How then does this connect with

1002
00:32:52,932 --> 00:32:54,078
the sponsor world?

1003
00:32:54,080 --> 00:32:56,372
Because there's clearly sponsors of

1004
00:32:56,372 --> 00:32:58,338
the Olympic movement in international

1005
00:32:58,338 --> 00:33:00,572
level, at the US level, etc.

1006
00:33:00,572 --> 00:33:02,100
But athletes also have

1007
00:33:02,100 --> 00:33:03,628
have their own sponsors,

1008
00:33:03,630 --> 00:33:06,276
which is how they can afford to

1009
00:33:06,276 --> 00:33:08,973
get where they are,

1010
00:33:08,973 --> 00:33:11,844
where they're going, a lot of times,

1011
00:33:11,844 --> 00:33:14,430
how does that dynamic work between

1012
00:33:14,523 --> 00:33:16,939
athletes and their sponsors?

1013
00:33:16,940 --> 00:33:17,832
Personal sponsors,

1014
00:33:17,832 --> 00:33:20,062
especially as you're kind of

1015
00:33:20,062 --> 00:33:22,569
heading into that world right now.

1016
00:33:22,570 --> 00:33:25,237
Yeah, so again really are big question here

1017
00:33:25,240 --> 00:33:27,604
is trading off the

1018
00:33:27,604 --> 00:33:29,976
Olympic good will by a third party

1019
00:33:29,976 --> 00:33:32,475
who is not a USOPC sponsor.

1020
00:33:32,480 --> 00:33:33,449
So you know,

1021
00:33:33,449 --> 00:33:35,387
oftentimes we do work with athletes

1022
00:33:35,387 --> 00:33:37,485
and their personal sponsors on

1023
00:33:37,485 --> 00:33:39,625
campaigns that include a factual

1024
00:33:39,625 --> 00:33:41,238
reference to an achievement.

1025
00:33:41,240 --> 00:33:43,526
But we ask again that that

1026
00:33:43,526 --> 00:33:44,669
approach be balanced.

1027
00:33:44,670 --> 00:33:47,470
So if a company is sponsoring

1028
00:33:47,470 --> 00:33:49,562
an individual athlete and that

1029
00:33:49,562 --> 00:33:52,184
athlete is an Olympian or Paralympian,

1030
00:33:52,190 --> 00:33:54,005
describing that achievement in a

1031
00:33:54,005 --> 00:33:56,097
factual way is something that we

1032
00:33:56,097 --> 00:33:57,825
do work with them on and we try

1033
00:33:57,825 --> 00:33:59,723
to work on campaigns proactively

1034
00:33:59,723 --> 00:34:01,743
so that other achievements are

1035
00:34:01,743 --> 00:34:03,810
included and the trading off the

1036
00:34:03,810 --> 00:34:05,470
Olympic good will thing just doesn't,

1037
00:34:05,470 --> 00:34:08,358
it doesn't feel like the

1038
00:34:08,358 --> 00:34:11,527
company is trading off Olympic good will or

1039
00:34:11,527 --> 00:34:14,190
associating themselves with the USOPC.

1040
00:34:14,190 --> 00:34:16,110
Yeah, it's a fascinating thing because

1041
00:34:16,110 --> 00:34:18,399
you see this especially I would

1042
00:34:18,400 --> 00:34:21,064
guess, the closer you get to the games,

1043
00:34:21,064 --> 00:34:22,950
those individual sponsors want to

1044
00:34:22,950 --> 00:34:25,248
be able to acknowledge their

1045
00:34:25,248 --> 00:34:27,176
connection to this athlete and etc.

1046
00:34:27,180 --> 00:34:29,655
And I understand there's something

1047
00:34:29,655 --> 00:34:33,500
called a diocese level called Rule 40.

1048
00:34:33,500 --> 00:34:34,568
Yeah, there is.

1049
00:34:34,568 --> 00:34:36,800
I'll get to Rule 40 in a second.

1050
00:34:36,800 --> 00:34:37,868
I just wanted to

1051
00:34:37,868 --> 00:34:39,812
if you don't mind touch on one

1052
00:34:39,812 --> 00:34:41,474
other aspect that we do see,

1053
00:34:41,480 --> 00:34:43,310
kind of the Olympian, Paralympian

1054
00:34:43,310 --> 00:34:44,774
biographical reference piece being

1055
00:34:44,774 --> 00:34:46,754
used quite a bit and that's

1056
00:34:46,754 --> 00:34:48,659
really in the world's of fundraising

1057
00:34:48,659 --> 00:34:50,549
and other third parties kind of using

1058
00:34:50,550 --> 00:34:52,255
speaking engagements or fundraising

1059
00:34:52,255 --> 00:34:53,278
opportunities whereby athletes

1060
00:34:53,278 --> 00:34:53,960
are participated,

1061
00:34:53,960 --> 00:34:55,615
participating or part of these

1062
00:34:55,615 --> 00:34:58,049
organizations and part of the fundraising,

1063
00:34:58,050 --> 00:34:58,666
you know,

1064
00:34:58,666 --> 00:35:00,514
is going to reference that the

1065
00:35:00,514 --> 00:35:02,828
athlete is an Olympian or Paralympian.

1066
00:35:02,830 --> 00:35:05,550
It's a very similar analysis

1067
00:35:05,550 --> 00:35:05,898
in this one, Dave.

1068
00:35:05,898 --> 00:35:07,986
We ask that fund raising initiative

1069
00:35:07,986 --> 00:35:09,990
so they don't trade off USOPC

1070
00:35:09,990 --> 00:35:12,036
good will. Also lists kind of

1071
00:35:12,036 --> 00:35:13,793
the athletes achievements in a

1072
00:35:13,793 --> 00:35:15,803
balance matter and not

1073
00:35:15,803 --> 00:35:16,808
otherwise USOPC IP.

1074
00:35:16,810 --> 00:35:18,394
So it comes in

1075
00:35:18,394 --> 00:35:22,328
a whole bunch of different ways

1076
00:35:22,330 --> 00:35:24,591
and it's probably one of the more

1077
00:35:24,591 --> 00:35:26,040
common questions that we see.

1078
00:35:26,040 --> 00:35:27,580
Oh, I would think so,

1079
00:35:27,580 --> 00:35:29,440
especially because the pool of athletes,

1080
00:35:29,440 --> 00:35:30,748
so to speak,

1081
00:35:30,748 --> 00:35:32,056
of Olympians just

1082
00:35:32,060 --> 00:35:33,986
you know grows constantly and changes

1083
00:35:33,986 --> 00:35:36,849
etc. and as the world around them

1084
00:35:36,850 --> 00:35:38,470
changes and organizations want to

1085
00:35:38,470 --> 00:35:40,924
be involved, it must be

1086
00:35:40,924 --> 00:35:42,730
never ending. Do you ever feel like

1087
00:35:42,790 --> 00:35:44,968
you've seen all the situations and

1088
00:35:44,968 --> 00:35:47,056
then you're constantly reminded you haven't?

1089
00:35:47,056 --> 00:35:47,374
Yes,

1090
00:35:47,374 --> 00:35:48,646
actually I do.

1091
00:35:48,650 --> 00:35:51,413
I mean like I can think of one the

1092
00:35:51,413 --> 00:35:54,387
other day where I was like oh my gosh,

1093
00:35:54,390 --> 00:35:56,595
I didn't even know that this could

1094
00:35:56,595 --> 00:35:58,793
happen but you learn every day and

1095
00:35:58,793 --> 00:36:00,983
the beauty of this is that again

1096
00:36:00,983 --> 00:36:03,077
most people are using our marks

1097
00:36:03,080 --> 00:36:04,970
in a manner because they are

1098
00:36:04,970 --> 00:36:06,230
excited about the games.

1099
00:36:06,230 --> 00:36:08,086
So a lot of times you can get

1100
00:36:08,086 --> 00:36:09,887
people to shift their perspective

1101
00:36:09,887 --> 00:36:11,587
or shift their engagement.

1102
00:36:11,590 --> 00:36:12,256
Given that,

1103
00:36:12,256 --> 00:36:13,921
given that they're excited about

1104
00:36:13,921 --> 00:36:15,843
the games and they really are

1105
00:36:15,843 --> 00:36:17,565
trying to do the right thing,

1106
00:36:17,570 --> 00:36:19,614
we get a lot of requests from

1107
00:36:19,614 --> 00:36:21,349
educators and from summer camps,

1108
00:36:21,350 --> 00:36:23,240
people who want to put on

1109
00:36:23,240 --> 00:36:24,500
educational materials, teach kids,

1110
00:36:24,500 --> 00:36:25,760
teach community members about

1111
00:36:25,760 --> 00:36:27,020
Olympism, about sportsmanship,

1112
00:36:27,020 --> 00:36:29,540
about the games, the history of the games,

1113
00:36:29,540 --> 00:36:30,170
Olympic values.

1114
00:36:30,170 --> 00:36:32,375
A lot of those requests and there are

1115
00:36:32,380 --> 00:36:34,900
also ones that we work with people on

1116
00:36:34,900 --> 00:36:36,750
if it's a non commercial,

1117
00:36:36,750 --> 00:36:38,098
educational request and there's

1118
00:36:38,098 --> 00:36:39,446
no third party sponsors.

1119
00:36:39,450 --> 00:36:40,674
We do, in cases,

1120
00:36:40,674 --> 00:36:42,204
authorize certain USOPC IP to be

1121
00:36:42,204 --> 00:36:44,187
used in that educational context.

1122
00:36:44,190 --> 00:36:46,549
There are some guiderails around there.

1123
00:36:46,550 --> 00:36:48,818
We would ask that you know such

1124
00:36:48,818 --> 00:36:50,550
educational materials not be published

1125
00:36:50,550 --> 00:36:52,295
or available in certain media,

1126
00:36:52,300 --> 00:36:54,060
but educating and promoting and

1127
00:36:54,060 --> 00:36:55,820
spreading the goodwill of the

1128
00:36:55,882 --> 00:36:57,467
games is something that we

1129
00:36:57,467 --> 00:36:59,052
do really want to encourage.

1130
00:36:59,060 --> 00:37:01,540
So you do see a pop up and sort of

1131
00:37:01,617 --> 00:37:04,245
other facilities where people are just

1132
00:37:04,245 --> 00:37:07,123
excited and trying to do the right thing.

1133
00:37:07,123 --> 00:37:09,573
They want a summer camp and

1134
00:37:09,580 --> 00:37:11,680
it's just so perfect because

1135
00:37:11,680 --> 00:37:13,939
the Tokyo Games are this summer,

1136
00:37:13,940 --> 00:37:15,755
so why wouldn't you have

1137
00:37:15,755 --> 00:37:17,570
Tokyo 2020 themed summer camp?

1138
00:37:17,570 --> 00:37:21,490
A lot of this stems from excitement.

1139
00:37:21,490 --> 00:37:23,569
Yeah, I think the way you

1140
00:37:23,570 --> 00:37:25,616
approach it also combined

1141
00:37:25,616 --> 00:37:27,916
with that theory is going to make

1142
00:37:27,916 --> 00:37:30,262
it a whole lot more efficient to

1143
00:37:30,262 --> 00:37:32,476
kind of do the things you need to do

1144
00:37:32,480 --> 00:37:34,577
and we always try to say if

1145
00:37:34,577 --> 00:37:36,850
you can come away from these things

1146
00:37:36,850 --> 00:37:39,009
where the person you're dealing with,

1147
00:37:39,010 --> 00:37:41,089
is still a fan,

1148
00:37:41,090 --> 00:37:43,448
but maybe even more of one, it's

1149
00:37:43,448 --> 00:37:46,128
a win. That I consider to be a

1150
00:37:46,128 --> 00:37:48,713
win as well, and you know it's

1151
00:37:48,713 --> 00:37:50,668
never fun to have a conversation

1152
00:37:50,668 --> 00:37:52,338
with someone and this especially

1153
00:37:52,338 --> 00:37:54,458
comes into play, Dave, with regard to

1154
00:37:54,460 --> 00:37:56,180
businesses who have been using names

1155
00:37:56,180 --> 00:37:57,900
such as Olympic for awhile.

1156
00:37:57,900 --> 00:38:00,098
There are some out there that we

1157
00:38:00,098 --> 00:38:02,282
just didn't know about and sometimes

1158
00:38:02,282 --> 00:38:04,628
it crosses my desk because someone

1159
00:38:04,628 --> 00:38:06,498
writes an email and says hey,

1160
00:38:06,500 --> 00:38:08,719
is this use of Olympic authorized and

1161
00:38:08,719 --> 00:38:10,839
sometimes it crosses my desk because

1162
00:38:10,839 --> 00:38:12,684
someone filed a trademark application.

1163
00:38:12,690 --> 00:38:14,700
Sometimes it crosses my desk

1164
00:38:14,700 --> 00:38:16,800
because they filed for a local

1165
00:38:16,800 --> 00:38:18,535
business license with the Secretary

1166
00:38:18,535 --> 00:38:20,950
of State and some of those state

1167
00:38:20,950 --> 00:38:22,446
secretaries reach out proactively

1168
00:38:22,446 --> 00:38:24,690
and say hey is this authorized?

1169
00:38:24,690 --> 00:38:26,300
Is this something that's allowed?

1170
00:38:26,300 --> 00:38:27,580
Those conversations can be

1171
00:38:27,580 --> 00:38:28,220
really challenging,

1172
00:38:28,220 --> 00:38:29,915
especially if that business has

1173
00:38:29,915 --> 00:38:31,964
been around for 10 years and

1174
00:38:31,964 --> 00:38:33,680
we just didn't know about it.

1175
00:38:33,680 --> 00:38:35,878
So it's something that we really have

1176
00:38:35,878 --> 00:38:38,656
to work with people and do so in a

1177
00:38:38,656 --> 00:38:40,594
thoughtful manner to make sure that

1178
00:38:40,594 --> 00:38:42,664
not only our assets are protected,

1179
00:38:42,670 --> 00:38:44,966
but that we're also hearing them and

1180
00:38:44,966 --> 00:38:47,202
working with them in

1181
00:38:47,202 --> 00:38:49,729
ways that you know at least they don't ...

1182
00:38:49,730 --> 00:38:51,335
The entire process

1183
00:38:51,335 --> 00:38:52,940
of transitioning a brand, Dave

1184
00:38:52,940 --> 00:38:54,860
as you know, is not fun,

1185
00:38:54,860 --> 00:38:56,236
especially an established one.

1186
00:38:56,236 --> 00:38:58,617
So you know it's working with people

1187
00:38:58,617 --> 00:39:00,885
to try to make that a little bit more

1188
00:39:00,950 --> 00:39:03,001
that process go a little bit more

1189
00:39:03,001 --> 00:39:04,759
smoothly and kind of realizing some

1190
00:39:04,759 --> 00:39:06,517
of the considerations

1191
00:39:06,517 --> 00:39:07,390
that may arise.

1192
00:39:07,390 --> 00:39:08,855
So some of these conversations

1193
00:39:08,855 --> 00:39:10,027
can be really challenging.

1194
00:39:10,030 --> 00:39:11,782
It's not always people who are

1195
00:39:11,782 --> 00:39:14,128
happy to get off the phone with me,

1196
00:39:14,130 --> 00:39:16,474
but I think at least from my perspective,

1197
00:39:16,480 --> 00:39:18,154
if we can explain why we're

1198
00:39:18,154 --> 00:39:20,289
doing it the way we're doing it,

1199
00:39:20,290 --> 00:39:21,750
and if we can keep,

1200
00:39:21,750 --> 00:39:23,633
you know if the conversations are respectful

1201
00:39:23,633 --> 00:39:25,269
and they're empowering, they're enthusiastic.

1202
00:39:25,270 --> 00:39:26,606
I think that.

1203
00:39:26,606 --> 00:39:28,028
eventually, a lot of people,

1204
00:39:28,028 --> 00:39:29,660
people do feel a little bit

1205
00:39:29,731 --> 00:39:31,526
less upset about the message,

1206
00:39:31,530 --> 00:39:33,990
at least is my hope.

1207
00:39:33,990 --> 00:39:34,247
Yeah,

1208
00:39:34,247 --> 00:39:35,018
well I could,

1209
00:39:35,018 --> 00:39:37,699
I think it does and I think you've got

1210
00:39:37,700 --> 00:39:39,868
a good approach ecause it's

1211
00:39:39,868 --> 00:39:42,152
a very delicate situation because you're

1212
00:39:42,152 --> 00:39:44,839
not just like a normal commercial brand.

1213
00:39:44,840 --> 00:39:47,432
In many ways, I mean it has this enormous

1214
00:39:47,432 --> 00:39:49,402
history first of all, and then it

1215
00:39:49,402 --> 00:39:51,106
has this international aspect to it.

1216
00:39:51,110 --> 00:39:53,406
And then it has all of these

1217
00:39:53,406 --> 00:39:55,738
aspects of, it's part of our,

1218
00:39:55,740 --> 00:39:56,884
especially on the US side,

1219
00:39:56,884 --> 00:39:59,502
it's part of our country, so to speak,

1220
00:39:59,502 --> 00:40:03,518
and people do tend to feel very part of that.

1221
00:40:03,520 --> 00:40:06,569
And we saw it sometimes on the brand I

1222
00:40:06,569 --> 00:40:09,300
worked for. It was part of people's lives.

1223
00:40:09,300 --> 00:40:10,670
You know it was there

1224
00:40:10,670 --> 00:40:11,766
when they got married.

1225
00:40:11,770 --> 00:40:13,970
It was there when they had their first child,

1226
00:40:13,970 --> 00:40:14,747
you know it

1227
00:40:14,747 --> 00:40:16,042
just it becomes that connection

1228
00:40:16,042 --> 00:40:18,041
and I think you know it's

1229
00:40:18,041 --> 00:40:19,466
challenging to walk that line.

1230
00:40:19,470 --> 00:40:20,820
You seem to do it really well.

1231
00:40:20,820 --> 00:40:22,500
It is challenging

1232
00:40:22,500 --> 00:40:24,439
but it's something that I think is

1233
00:40:24,439 --> 00:40:26,127
really important and I think it's

1234
00:40:26,127 --> 00:40:27,996
something that you know we've all heard

1235
00:40:28,000 --> 00:40:28,804
trademark bully stories.

1236
00:40:28,804 --> 00:40:30,412
I hate the word bully when

1237
00:40:30,412 --> 00:40:31,849
it comes to trademark,

1238
00:40:31,850 --> 00:40:33,690
It's something that terrifies me.

1239
00:40:33,690 --> 00:40:35,530
it's something that you don't,

1240
00:40:35,530 --> 00:40:37,288
you don't want to be associated

1241
00:40:37,288 --> 00:40:38,460
with that term personally,

1242
00:40:38,460 --> 00:40:40,476
and you don't want your brand to

1243
00:40:40,476 --> 00:40:41,970
be associated with that term.

1244
00:40:41,970 --> 00:40:44,314
The most important thing to me is that

1245
00:40:44,314 --> 00:40:46,658
you know when I reach out to people,

1246
00:40:46,660 --> 00:40:48,852
I see myself as an offshoot

1247
00:40:48,852 --> 00:40:49,890
of this brand,

1248
00:40:49,890 --> 00:40:51,350
as someone who's you know,

1249
00:40:51,350 --> 00:40:52,915
protecting and supporting the brand

1250
00:40:52,915 --> 00:40:55,138
in the way that the brand should

1251
00:40:55,138 --> 00:40:57,210
be protected and supported. So we do

1252
00:40:57,210 --> 00:40:59,363
try to do so with care and concern

1253
00:40:59,363 --> 00:41:01,336
for the people that we're talking to

1254
00:41:01,336 --> 00:41:03,130
and to engender enthusiasm and

1255
00:41:03,192 --> 00:41:05,118
continued support for the games and

1256
00:41:05,120 --> 00:41:07,759
for Team USA. Yeah, it's

1257
00:41:07,760 --> 00:41:10,000
amazing. We touched on

1258
00:41:10,000 --> 00:41:12,569
this and I'm glad you stayed on this

1259
00:41:12,569 --> 00:41:15,510
topic so we could talk about it more fully.

1260
00:41:15,510 --> 00:41:17,400
But there's this thing I wanted

1261
00:41:17,400 --> 00:41:19,070
to get to about this

1262
00:41:19,070 --> 00:41:21,766
Rule 40 that I never understood and

1263
00:41:21,766 --> 00:41:24,338
I'm curious about it and how it impacts

1264
00:41:24,338 --> 00:41:26,820
what people do and the purpose of it.

1265
00:41:26,820 --> 00:41:29,610
Because you do hear about it and I think

1266
00:41:29,610 --> 00:41:32,627
there may be a lot of misconception about it.

1267
00:41:32,630 --> 00:41:34,136
Yeah, sure,

1268
00:41:34,136 --> 00:41:34,889
absolutely.

1269
00:41:34,890 --> 00:41:39,000
So Rule 40 is a rule in the Olympic Charter.

1270
00:41:39,000 --> 00:41:42,573
And okay I'm going to back up even a

1271
00:41:42,573 --> 00:41:45,856
little bit more. Around games times,

1272
00:41:45,860 --> 00:41:47,512
as we discussed before,

1273
00:41:47,512 --> 00:41:49,577
USOPC sponsors, so Team USA

1274
00:41:49,577 --> 00:41:51,500
sponsors, domestic sponsors and

1275
00:41:51,500 --> 00:41:53,900
Olympic and Paralympic top sponsors

1276
00:41:53,900 --> 00:41:56,339
are authorized to use USOPC

1277
00:41:56,339 --> 00:41:58,457
intellectual property so that could be,

1278
00:41:58,460 --> 00:42:00,140
you know Team USA.

1279
00:42:00,140 --> 00:42:02,240
It could be the rings,

1280
00:42:02,240 --> 00:42:04,340
it could be Tokyo 2020.

1281
00:42:04,340 --> 00:42:07,740
It could be the agitos.

1282
00:42:07,740 --> 00:42:10,676
You know a variety of USOPC IP

1283
00:42:10,680 --> 00:42:12,888
those sponsors are authorized to use.

1284
00:42:12,890 --> 00:42:15,466
On the flip side of that equation,

1285
00:42:15,470 --> 00:42:17,828
non sponsors are not authorized to

1286
00:42:17,828 --> 00:42:20,620
use those brands and so that is

1287
00:42:20,620 --> 00:42:22,460
a truism regardless of whether

1288
00:42:22,460 --> 00:42:24,300
it's game time or not,

1289
00:42:24,300 --> 00:42:26,876
but as I'm sure you can imagine,

1290
00:42:26,880 --> 00:42:29,393
during games times there is an uptick

1291
00:42:29,393 --> 00:42:32,028
in people who are using the brands,

1292
00:42:32,030 --> 00:42:33,875
especially people who don't know

1293
00:42:33,875 --> 00:42:35,720
or appreciate that the terms

1294
00:42:35,782 --> 00:42:37,837
Olympic and Paralympic are brands

1295
00:42:37,840 --> 00:42:39,308
and there our brands.

1296
00:42:39,308 --> 00:42:41,510
So that's kind of one piece,

1297
00:42:41,510 --> 00:42:43,470
so there's there's one thing

1298
00:42:43,470 --> 00:42:45,826
to consider during the Rule 40

1299
00:42:45,826 --> 00:42:47,746
period is the use of USOPC IP,

1300
00:42:47,750 --> 00:42:51,044
and this is again despite the Rule 40 period.

1301
00:42:51,050 --> 00:42:53,300
Sorry, but it is not authorized

1302
00:42:53,300 --> 00:42:56,190
commercially for a non USOPC sponsor.

1303
00:42:56,190 --> 00:42:58,158
So that's one piece of the

1304
00:42:58,158 --> 00:43:00,590
puzzle. Rule 40, as you mentioned,

1305
00:43:00,590 --> 00:43:03,159
is a rule in the Olympic Charter.

1306
00:43:03,160 --> 00:43:05,205
It's called the bylaw to Rule 40

1307
00:43:05,205 --> 00:43:07,250
and this can affect campaigns

1308
00:43:07,323 --> 00:43:09,507
run by what we call an athlete

1309
00:43:09,510 --> 00:43:10,174
personal sponsor.

1310
00:43:10,174 --> 00:43:12,830
So a sponsor that's a sponsor of an

1311
00:43:12,900 --> 00:43:15,140
athlete but not necessarily or not a

1312
00:43:15,140 --> 00:43:17,860
sponsor of USOPC in this particular case,

1313
00:43:17,860 --> 00:43:19,780
the Rule 40 period is for

1314
00:43:19,780 --> 00:43:21,530
a set period of time.

1315
00:43:21,530 --> 00:43:23,438
Typically it runs about 10 days

1316
00:43:23,438 --> 00:43:25,120
before opening ceremonies and two

1317
00:43:25,120 --> 00:43:26,536
days after closing ceremonies.

1318
00:43:26,540 --> 00:43:29,158
It's about the time that the Olympic

1319
00:43:29,158 --> 00:43:31,538
Village is active and there's a parallel

1320
00:43:31,538 --> 00:43:34,230
to Rule 40 in the IP for the IPC.

1321
00:43:34,230 --> 00:43:36,554
So for the Paralympic Games as well,

1322
00:43:36,560 --> 00:43:38,275
there's a parallel that exists

1323
00:43:38,275 --> 00:43:39,647
there. And what Rule 40

1324
00:43:39,650 --> 00:43:41,883
does is it sets certain guidelines

1325
00:43:41,883 --> 00:43:44,209
for how a participant's name,

1326
00:43:44,210 --> 00:43:46,376
image, and likeness can be used

1327
00:43:46,376 --> 00:43:48,390
during this Rule 40 period.

1328
00:43:48,390 --> 00:43:49,910
This particular rule applies

1329
00:43:49,910 --> 00:43:51,810
to all current competitors.

1330
00:43:51,810 --> 00:43:52,570
So again,

1331
00:43:52,570 --> 00:43:54,090
if you're not currently

1332
00:43:54,090 --> 00:43:55,610
competing in the games,

1333
00:43:55,610 --> 00:43:58,186
the Rule 40 period and the Rule

1334
00:43:58,186 --> 00:43:59,790
40 regulations don't apply,

1335
00:43:59,790 --> 00:44:02,070
but it applies to all competitors,

1336
00:44:02,070 --> 00:44:02,486
coaches,

1337
00:44:02,486 --> 00:44:04,982
trainers and officials who are participating

1338
00:44:04,982 --> 00:44:07,769
in the Olympic Games and in general,

1339
00:44:07,770 --> 00:44:11,586
what it really kind of means is that ...

1340
00:44:11,590 --> 00:44:13,350
Or let me actually just

1341
00:44:13,350 --> 00:44:15,110
say what Rule 40 says,

1342
00:44:15,110 --> 00:44:16,910
because that can probably put

1343
00:44:16,910 --> 00:44:18,980
a little more clarity on it.

1344
00:44:18,980 --> 00:44:21,444
So Rule 40 states that competitors,

1345
00:44:21,450 --> 00:44:23,502
team officials and other team personnel

1346
00:44:23,502 --> 00:44:25,685
who compete in the Olympic Games may

1347
00:44:25,685 --> 00:44:27,570
allow their person, name, picture,

1348
00:44:27,570 --> 00:44:30,061
sports performances to be used for

1349
00:44:30,061 --> 00:44:31,681
advertising purposes during the games

1350
00:44:31,681 --> 00:44:33,418
in accordance with the principles

1351
00:44:33,418 --> 00:44:35,530
determined by the IOC Executive Board.

1352
00:44:35,530 --> 00:44:36,004
So,

1353
00:44:36,004 --> 00:44:38,848
the IOC Executive Board has determined

1354
00:44:38,848 --> 00:44:41,746
its principles and in the US we have

1355
00:44:41,750 --> 00:44:43,690
taken those principles and created

1356
00:44:43,690 --> 00:44:45,630
some domestic guidance for Team

1357
00:44:45,697 --> 00:44:47,377
USA athletes and for athlete

1358
00:44:47,380 --> 00:44:49,510
personal sponsors who intend to

1359
00:44:49,510 --> 00:44:51,640
activate in the United States

1360
00:44:51,712 --> 00:44:53,959
during the Rule 40 period. At its

1361
00:44:53,959 --> 00:44:56,085
heart, Rule 40 is an eligibility

1362
00:44:56,085 --> 00:44:58,626
rule introduced by the IOC for the

1363
00:44:58,630 --> 00:45:00,680
purpose of maintaining the unique

1364
00:45:00,680 --> 00:45:02,320
and universal competitive environment

1365
00:45:02,320 --> 00:45:03,880
offered by the Olympic Games.

1366
00:45:03,880 --> 00:45:06,088
So the rule helps ensure global

1367
00:45:06,088 --> 00:45:08,380
protection at the games and helps

1368
00:45:08,380 --> 00:45:10,255
maintain the long term health

1369
00:45:10,255 --> 00:45:11,668
of the movement, but

1370
00:45:11,668 --> 00:45:13,684
as I mentioned in the United States,

1371
00:45:13,690 --> 00:45:15,172
we've kind of taken a different

1372
00:45:15,172 --> 00:45:16,699
approach to it this year rather

1373
00:45:16,699 --> 00:45:18,393
than what we've done in the past,

1374
00:45:18,400 --> 00:45:19,640
and I'm excited about this.

1375
00:45:23,240 --> 00:45:24,446
So there's a new approach.

1376
00:45:24,446 --> 00:45:26,903
So there is.

1377
00:45:26,903 --> 00:45:29,824
So we have created in the US what is

1378
00:45:29,824 --> 00:45:32,029
called a personal sponsor commitment.

1379
00:45:32,030 --> 00:45:34,494
So what this does is there is a

1380
00:45:34,494 --> 00:45:36,993
portal on the USOPC website, on

1381
00:45:36,993 --> 00:45:39,384
the Team USA website, whereby

1382
00:45:39,384 --> 00:45:41,428
athletes and personal sponsors

1383
00:45:41,430 --> 00:45:43,614
can enter into a personal sponsor

1384
00:45:43,614 --> 00:45:45,070
commitment through that portal.

1385
00:45:45,070 --> 00:45:46,990
So basically what this means

1386
00:45:46,990 --> 00:45:49,440
is that an athlete can go in,

1387
00:45:49,440 --> 00:45:51,918
can indicate his or her personal sponsors

1388
00:45:51,918 --> 00:45:53,810
and those personal sponsors can

1389
00:45:53,810 --> 00:45:55,262
then, with the athlete,

1390
00:45:55,262 --> 00:45:57,077
execute the personal sponsor commitment.

1391
00:45:57,080 --> 00:45:59,095
The personal sponsor commitment is

1392
00:45:59,095 --> 00:46:01,110
something that we've developed in

1393
00:46:01,175 --> 00:46:03,415
the United States and it sets out

1394
00:46:03,415 --> 00:46:05,151
clear guidelines for what these

1395
00:46:05,151 --> 00:46:06,931
athlete personal sponsors can and

1396
00:46:06,931 --> 00:46:09,748
can't do during the Rule 40 period,

1397
00:46:09,748 --> 00:46:11,496
including picture examples which

1398
00:46:11,496 --> 00:46:13,866
I've actually found to be some of

1399
00:46:13,866 --> 00:46:16,220
the most helpful of all the examples.

1400
00:46:16,220 --> 00:46:18,418
That when you can see a picture

1401
00:46:18,418 --> 00:46:20,020
of how something operates,

1402
00:46:20,020 --> 00:46:21,052
it's great.

1403
00:46:21,052 --> 00:46:21,740
But anyway,

1404
00:46:21,740 --> 00:46:23,438
so this new system allows current

1405
00:46:23,438 --> 00:46:25,448
Team USA Partners and official Olympic

1406
00:46:25,448 --> 00:46:27,493
and Paralympic partners to maintain

1407
00:46:27,493 --> 00:46:29,111
their exclusive marketing rights

1408
00:46:29,111 --> 00:46:30,766
and to gain enhanced protection

1409
00:46:30,766 --> 00:46:32,754
for enforcement while at the same

1410
00:46:32,754 --> 00:46:35,078
time the system makes it easier for

1411
00:46:35,078 --> 00:46:36,917
athletes to engage in marketing

1412
00:46:36,920 --> 00:46:38,710
by allowing these athlete personal

1413
00:46:38,710 --> 00:46:40,500
sponsors to obtain permission to

1414
00:46:40,559 --> 00:46:42,449
use athlete images pursuant to these

1415
00:46:42,449 --> 00:46:44,492
guidelines that we put forward in

1416
00:46:44,492 --> 00:46:46,658
these personal sponsor commitments.

1417
00:46:46,660 --> 00:46:48,868
So that's kind of the system that

1418
00:46:48,868 --> 00:46:50,340
we're hoping to implement.

1419
00:46:50,340 --> 00:46:53,164
We're hoping that it can be a fair

1420
00:46:53,164 --> 00:46:55,489
and understood system at the outset,

1421
00:46:55,490 --> 00:46:57,961
and that this process creates a shared

1422
00:46:57,961 --> 00:46:59,540
responsibility among personal sponsors

1423
00:46:59,540 --> 00:47:01,072
and athletes through this

1424
00:47:01,072 --> 00:47:02,604
contractual mechanism that we

1425
00:47:02,604 --> 00:47:04,688
hope will not only protect

1426
00:47:04,690 --> 00:47:06,898
USOPC sponsors and the games themselves,

1427
00:47:06,900 --> 00:47:09,324
but will also allow a streamlined

1428
00:47:09,324 --> 00:47:11,481
process for athlete marketing

1429
00:47:11,481 --> 00:47:13,786
in the United States.

1430
00:47:13,790 --> 00:47:14,125
Well,

1431
00:47:14,125 --> 00:47:15,800
it's gotta be immensely helpful

1432
00:47:15,800 --> 00:47:16,805
for everybody involved,

1433
00:47:16,810 --> 00:47:19,490
because there's a place they can go to ...

1434
00:47:19,490 --> 00:47:21,500
We used to get questions,

1435
00:47:21,500 --> 00:47:24,132
so and so authorized to do ads and

1436
00:47:24,132 --> 00:47:27,186
it's far easier to be able to look like,

1437
00:47:27,190 --> 00:47:28,870
oh yeah, they're a sponsor,

1438
00:47:28,870 --> 00:47:30,540
it's okay or well, yeah,

1439
00:47:30,540 --> 00:47:31,186
they're sponsor,

1440
00:47:31,186 --> 00:47:33,447
but check with Dana or just having

1441
00:47:33,447 --> 00:47:35,194
that resource of information has

1442
00:47:35,194 --> 00:47:37,240
gotta be useful and just some

1443
00:47:37,240 --> 00:47:39,250
of the predictability in it,

1444
00:47:39,250 --> 00:47:41,903
especially given the size of sponsors of

1445
00:47:41,903 --> 00:47:44,148
athletes versus sponsors of the whole team,

1446
00:47:44,150 --> 00:47:45,044
you know etc.

1447
00:47:45,044 --> 00:47:46,236
Yeah, so I mean our

1448
00:47:46,240 --> 00:47:48,632
hope is that this will be a

1449
00:47:48,632 --> 00:47:49,230
streamlined process.

1450
00:47:49,230 --> 00:47:51,169
Our hope is that this will make

1451
00:47:51,169 --> 00:47:52,520
things easier and clearer.

1452
00:47:52,520 --> 00:47:54,270
We are really trying to have things

1453
00:47:54,270 --> 00:47:56,410
be clear in a straightforward manner,

1454
00:47:56,410 --> 00:47:58,794
which is why we have brand usage guidelines,

1455
00:47:58,800 --> 00:48:02,967
which is why we're trying to do this process.

1456
00:48:02,970 --> 00:48:03,958
The more I think,

1457
00:48:03,958 --> 00:48:05,777
the more precise and the more succinct

1458
00:48:05,777 --> 00:48:07,758
that we can be in our communications

1459
00:48:07,758 --> 00:48:10,120
that are available online into the public,

1460
00:48:10,120 --> 00:48:12,234
the easier this is for everyone and

1461
00:48:12,234 --> 00:48:13,982
the more enjoyable. No one wants

1462
00:48:13,982 --> 00:48:15,548
to hear from me during games time.

1463
00:48:15,550 --> 00:48:17,838
I know that my phone call

1464
00:48:17,840 --> 00:48:20,415
no one wants to pick up, so I mean,

1465
00:48:20,415 --> 00:48:22,700
if we can, you know,

1466
00:48:22,700 --> 00:48:24,130
kind of sidestep that process,

1467
00:48:24,130 --> 00:48:26,265
I think that it would be a

1468
00:48:26,265 --> 00:48:27,930
lot better for everyone.

1469
00:48:27,930 --> 00:48:29,350
Oh yeah, absolutely.

1470
00:48:29,350 --> 00:48:31,861
I gotta ask you a question because

1471
00:48:31,861 --> 00:48:34,373
you used this word a couple of times

1472
00:48:34,373 --> 00:48:36,821
and I racked my brain to think if

1473
00:48:36,821 --> 00:48:39,340
I'd ever heard it in all the time

1474
00:48:39,340 --> 00:48:40,970
involved in marketing and design peope.

1475
00:48:40,970 --> 00:48:42,600
You used the word agitos?

1476
00:48:42,600 --> 00:48:44,556
Oh okay, yes, so the agitos.

1477
00:48:44,560 --> 00:48:46,443
So the Olympic rings are the symbol

1478
00:48:46,443 --> 00:48:47,955
of the Olympic Committee and

1479
00:48:47,955 --> 00:48:50,216
the agitos are the symbol of the

1480
00:48:50,216 --> 00:48:51,730
International Paralympic Committee.

1481
00:48:51,730 --> 00:48:53,870
They exemplify spirit in motion

1482
00:48:53,870 --> 00:48:56,423
and they are also protected by

1483
00:48:56,423 --> 00:48:57,759
the Ted Stevens Act.

1484
00:48:57,760 --> 00:48:58,410
Interesting, okay

1485
00:48:58,410 --> 00:49:00,360
gotta add that new word today.

1486
00:49:00,360 --> 00:49:01,323
Yeah so,

1487
00:49:01,323 --> 00:49:03,570
in the United States we're a

1488
00:49:03,634 --> 00:49:05,560
steward of that brand as well.

1489
00:49:05,560 --> 00:49:07,723
We protect and enforce

1490
00:49:07,723 --> 00:49:10,108
that brand in alignment with the

1491
00:49:10,110 --> 00:49:11,410
International Paralympic Committee

1492
00:49:11,410 --> 00:49:12,710
and their guidance.

1493
00:49:12,710 --> 00:49:14,999
I saw one question come through, Dave,

1494
00:49:14,999 --> 00:49:17,379
that I wanted to touch base on and

1495
00:49:17,379 --> 00:49:19,162
it had to do with international

1496
00:49:19,162 --> 00:49:21,634
issues and jurisdiction, and I think

1497
00:49:21,634 --> 00:49:24,170
that this is something that a lot

1498
00:49:24,170 --> 00:49:26,359
of folks may not appreciate or know.

1499
00:49:26,360 --> 00:49:28,208
So our jurisdiction

1500
00:49:28,208 --> 00:49:30,520
at USOPC is the United States.

1501
00:49:30,520 --> 00:49:31,840
Every country that competes

1502
00:49:31,840 --> 00:49:33,616
in the games has a national

1503
00:49:33,616 --> 00:49:35,616
Olympic committee and that national

1504
00:49:35,616 --> 00:49:36,416
Olympic committee,

1505
00:49:36,420 --> 00:49:38,388
we are a national Olympic committee,

1506
00:49:38,390 --> 00:49:40,358
that national Olympic committee

1507
00:49:40,360 --> 00:49:41,825
enforces the rules and

1508
00:49:41,825 --> 00:49:43,749
regulations of the charter as well

1509
00:49:43,749 --> 00:49:44,949
as intellectual property,

1510
00:49:44,950 --> 00:49:46,238
and their particular jurisdictions.

1511
00:49:46,238 --> 00:49:48,560
So my job is very US based,

1512
00:49:48,560 --> 00:49:50,588
which is so different from what

1513
00:49:50,588 --> 00:49:52,819
I was doing before I came here.

1514
00:49:52,820 --> 00:49:54,955
But it creates also kind of an

1515
00:49:54,955 --> 00:49:57,182
interplay with the NOC's. If we

1516
00:49:57,182 --> 00:49:59,501
find out about something that seems to

1517
00:49:59,501 --> 00:50:01,799
be problematic in a different territory,

1518
00:50:01,800 --> 00:50:03,336
we don't do anything about it,

1519
00:50:03,340 --> 00:50:05,364
but you can flip it to Canada or

1520
00:50:05,364 --> 00:50:06,954
Australia and they can handle

1521
00:50:06,954 --> 00:50:08,659
it appropriately with regard to

1522
00:50:08,659 --> 00:50:10,228
their statutes and their laws.

1523
00:50:10,230 --> 00:50:12,099
That's actually one of the things I

1524
00:50:12,099 --> 00:50:14,028
was going to ask you about because

1525
00:50:14,028 --> 00:50:16,236
there's gotta be a Dana in every

1526
00:50:16,236 --> 00:50:18,693
country on the planet that does what you do.

1527
00:50:18,693 --> 00:50:20,877
But do you tend to go and work,

1528
00:50:20,880 --> 00:50:22,240
you know your Canadian counterparts,

1529
00:50:22,240 --> 00:50:24,144
so you go back and forth?

1530
00:50:24,150 --> 00:50:26,274
Or do you tend to go back and forth

1531
00:50:26,274 --> 00:50:28,515
with the people in Geneva or whatever?

1532
00:50:28,520 --> 00:50:31,171
The IOC brand people are,

1533
00:50:31,171 --> 00:50:33,306
how do you orchestrate that?

1534
00:50:33,310 --> 00:50:35,368
The vast majority of my international

1535
00:50:35,368 --> 00:50:37,444
conversation are with the folks in

1536
00:50:37,444 --> 00:50:39,049
Laussane, the International Olympic Committee,

1537
00:50:39,049 --> 00:50:40,768
with regard to things that they

1538
00:50:40,768 --> 00:50:42,454
see in the US or, you know,

1539
00:50:42,454 --> 00:50:44,026
questions that we might have with

1540
00:50:44,026 --> 00:50:45,938
regard to various Olympic properties.

1541
00:50:45,940 --> 00:50:47,770
I've touched base with a couple

1542
00:50:47,770 --> 00:50:49,629
of the other NOC Danas

1543
00:50:49,630 --> 00:50:52,240
I think, just kind of to see how

1544
00:50:52,240 --> 00:50:54,558
they're doing and what they're up to,

1545
00:50:54,560 --> 00:50:55,484
especially during COVID,

1546
00:50:55,484 --> 00:50:57,640
so that's been nice and refreshing.

1547
00:50:57,640 --> 00:50:59,180
But no, there's not really

1548
00:50:59,180 --> 00:51:00,720
as big of an international,

1549
00:51:00,720 --> 00:51:02,260
at least our jurisdiction

1550
00:51:02,260 --> 00:51:04,228
here is in the United States.

1551
00:51:04,230 --> 00:51:05,595
And so that is really

1552
00:51:05,595 --> 00:51:06,960
where I protect our brand.

1553
00:51:06,960 --> 00:51:08,598
And that's really the market that

1554
00:51:08,598 --> 00:51:10,512
I'm focused on. Do you,

1555
00:51:10,512 --> 00:51:12,150
you must have a big team.

1556
00:51:12,150 --> 00:51:14,214
Or do you have a very lean team

1557
00:51:14,214 --> 00:51:16,236
that relies on lots of outside help?

1558
00:51:16,240 --> 00:51:17,208
Or how do you

1559
00:51:17,208 --> 00:51:19,250
manage all this workload?

1560
00:51:19,250 --> 00:51:21,346
Because it's got to go up and down just

1561
00:51:21,346 --> 00:51:23,607
in swells because of when the games are

1562
00:51:23,610 --> 00:51:26,585
and that's gotta be a huge challenge.

1563
00:51:26,590 --> 00:51:29,920
And it really is. So, our legal team at USOPC,

1564
00:51:29,920 --> 00:51:31,128
I'm the only intellectual

1565
00:51:31,128 --> 00:51:32,034
property attorney per se.

1566
00:51:32,040 --> 00:51:33,156
My partner USOPC,

1567
00:51:33,156 --> 00:51:34,830
she handles kind of our marks

1568
00:51:34,893 --> 00:51:36,289
in the commercial space,

1569
00:51:36,290 --> 00:51:39,008
so we kind of split this one in half.

1570
00:51:39,010 --> 00:51:41,434
But we work routinely together all the time.

1571
00:51:41,440 --> 00:51:43,852
You know, day in and day out because our

1572
00:51:43,852 --> 00:51:46,286
lives crossover so commonly in the space.

1573
00:51:46,290 --> 00:51:48,522
But during games times you know we do

1574
00:51:48,522 --> 00:51:51,440
have a couple of other folks that help out.

1575
00:51:51,440 --> 00:51:52,072
I am,

1576
00:51:52,072 --> 00:51:55,021
I actually think that I'm going to have a

1577
00:51:55,021 --> 00:51:57,829
decent amount of help during the games and

1578
00:51:57,830 --> 00:52:00,953
well, this is the first one that I have

1579
00:52:00,960 --> 00:52:02,496
been a part of. I'm very,

1580
00:52:02,500 --> 00:52:04,540
very excited to be a part of it,

1581
00:52:04,540 --> 00:52:05,052
but Dave,

1582
00:52:05,052 --> 00:52:07,100
it's one of those things I don't know.

1583
00:52:07,100 --> 00:52:09,148
We're going to see what the volume is.

1584
00:52:09,150 --> 00:52:10,430
I mean, we're going to

1585
00:52:10,430 --> 00:52:12,215
see what the volume is.

1586
00:52:12,220 --> 00:52:13,648
I will see if more Danas

1587
00:52:13,648 --> 00:52:15,040
are needed in the future.

1588
00:52:15,040 --> 00:52:15,562
Yeah true,

1589
00:52:15,562 --> 00:52:17,128
but does that mean during the

1590
00:52:17,128 --> 00:52:18,964
games you would go to Tokyo or

1591
00:52:18,964 --> 00:52:20,516
you would stay here because the

1592
00:52:20,516 --> 00:52:22,210
work you do is more focused here?

1593
00:52:22,210 --> 00:52:22,975
That's exactly right.

1594
00:52:22,975 --> 00:52:24,992
So during the games, as you might expect,

1595
00:52:24,992 --> 00:52:26,791
is one of our biggest times where

1596
00:52:26,791 --> 00:52:28,855
people use our marks and you know again,

1597
00:52:28,860 --> 00:52:30,140
oftentimes in a celebratory manner.

1598
00:52:30,140 --> 00:52:31,694
But there are things that we

1599
00:52:31,694 --> 00:52:33,340
need to address in real time

1600
00:52:33,340 --> 00:52:34,189
on the ground.

1601
00:52:34,189 --> 00:52:36,997
So, me and what I call my kind of

1602
00:52:36,997 --> 00:52:39,636
the folks who are helping me with

1603
00:52:39,636 --> 00:52:41,539
protecting our brands during the

1604
00:52:41,539 --> 00:52:43,980
games time, we are located in the

1605
00:52:43,980 --> 00:52:46,060
States and we are going to work to

1606
00:52:46,060 --> 00:52:48,157
protect the brands and field people's

1607
00:52:48,157 --> 00:52:49,937
complaints and field inquiries and

1608
00:52:49,995 --> 00:52:52,370
handle takedowns and handle conversations

1609
00:52:52,370 --> 00:52:54,145
where we're asking people to

1610
00:52:54,145 --> 00:52:57,353
transition off of a mark. 

1611
00:52:57,353 --> 00:52:59,393
So that particular part of our team

1612
00:52:59,473 --> 00:53:01,813
will be focused in the United

1613
00:53:01,813 --> 00:53:03,373
States during games time.

1614
00:53:03,380 --> 00:53:06,845
Yeah, it's gonna be a busy time I think.

1615
00:53:06,850 --> 00:53:09,610
So you had mentioned there's a

1616
00:53:09,610 --> 00:53:12,258
number of materials on the website.

1617
00:53:12,260 --> 00:53:14,570
Which website are you talking about?

1618
00:53:14,570 --> 00:53:16,410
The USOPC?

1619
00:53:16,410 --> 00:53:19,201
So it's Team USA, that's our website,

1620
00:53:19,201 --> 00:53:19,835
teamusa.org, pretty sure.

1621
00:53:19,835 --> 00:53:21,420
Eek, I should know that.

1622
00:53:21,420 --> 00:53:21,736
Yes,

1623
00:53:21,736 --> 00:53:23,316
I'm pretty sure it's teamusa.org,

1624
00:53:23,320 --> 00:53:25,704
but one of the things that I would

1625
00:53:25,704 --> 00:53:27,683
really encourage people to look at

1626
00:53:27,683 --> 00:53:29,338
our their brand usage guidelines.

1627
00:53:29,340 --> 00:53:31,296
We really try in those guidelines

1628
00:53:31,296 --> 00:53:32,600
to address a lot

1629
00:53:32,673 --> 00:53:33,873
of the questions that

1630
00:53:33,873 --> 00:53:35,673
we get on a daily basis.

1631
00:53:35,680 --> 00:53:37,582
For example, one of those guidelines

1632
00:53:37,582 --> 00:53:38,850
includes questions about artwork.

1633
00:53:38,850 --> 00:53:40,971
I get fan art all the time

1634
00:53:40,971 --> 00:53:42,969
about the rings and the agitos,

1635
00:53:42,970 --> 00:53:45,506
and new brands that people want to create.

1636
00:53:45,510 --> 00:53:47,090
It's inspiring that people are

1637
00:53:47,090 --> 00:53:49,168
inspired by our marks, but we

1638
00:53:49,168 --> 00:53:50,784
can't authorize simulations

1639
00:53:50,784 --> 00:53:53,070
of our brands and we're going

1640
00:53:53,070 --> 00:53:55,438
to ask you not to use it too.

1641
00:53:55,440 --> 00:53:58,158
So it's something that you know we try to

1642
00:53:58,160 --> 00:53:59,945
really be clear and succinct

1643
00:53:59,945 --> 00:54:01,505
on our brand usage guidelines

1644
00:54:01,505 --> 00:54:02,985
to give people guidance.

1645
00:54:02,990 --> 00:54:04,500
And then, as I mentioned,

1646
00:54:04,500 --> 00:54:06,312
my email or the legal IP

1647
00:54:06,312 --> 00:54:07,520
email address is on there.

1648
00:54:07,520 --> 00:54:09,368
So if you have a question after

1649
00:54:09,368 --> 00:54:11,139
reading the brand usage guidelines,

1650
00:54:11,140 --> 00:54:13,556
please feel free to reach out and ask.

1651
00:54:13,560 --> 00:54:14,768
We're happy to respond.

1652
00:54:14,768 --> 00:54:16,580
There's also the Rule 40 portal.

1653
00:54:16,580 --> 00:54:18,916
If there are any athletes or any personal

1654
00:54:18,916 --> 00:54:20,792
sponsors who are interested in that

1655
00:54:20,792 --> 00:54:22,920
program and haven't looked into it yet,

1656
00:54:22,920 --> 00:54:25,464
that's also on our website on Team USA.

1657
00:54:25,470 --> 00:54:27,540
There's a link to it and there's

1658
00:54:27,540 --> 00:54:29,278
also materials associated with it,

1659
00:54:29,280 --> 00:54:32,511
so you could access some of the pictures and

1660
00:54:32,511 --> 00:54:35,009
reference materials that I touched base on.

1661
00:54:35,010 --> 00:54:36,960
That's really helpful having those things.

1662
00:54:36,960 --> 00:54:39,235
So hey, listen, we kind of

1663
00:54:39,235 --> 00:54:41,837
of chewed up most of an hour here,

1664
00:54:41,840 --> 00:54:43,460
and it's been a fascinating conversation.

1665
00:54:43,460 --> 00:54:45,735
It's such an interesting area.

1666
00:54:45,740 --> 00:54:47,690
What you do is so interesting.

1667
00:54:47,690 --> 00:54:50,010
It's so timely and it's such a huge

1668
00:54:50,010 --> 00:54:52,237
issue in the sports world for people.

1669
00:54:52,240 --> 00:54:55,156
So thank you so much for joining us today

1670
00:54:55,160 --> 00:54:57,134
and we'll look forward to watching

1671
00:54:57,134 --> 00:54:59,389
you Olympics and that type of thing.

1672
00:54:59,390 --> 00:55:01,665
Thank you so much for having us,

1673
00:55:01,665 --> 00:55:02,640
it's been a pleasure.

1674
00:55:02,640 --> 00:55:04,999
Yeah, some day it'd be nice to do it

1675
00:55:04,999 --> 00:55:07,587
in person and actually have a fire

1676
00:55:07,590 --> 00:55:10,012
for the Fireside chat. I was

1677
00:55:10,012 --> 00:55:12,500
waiting for that graphic to come up.

1678
00:55:12,500 --> 00:55:15,307
Yeah, they couldn't figure that one out,

1679
00:55:15,310 --> 00:55:17,320
but it is easily here.

1680
00:55:17,320 --> 00:55:18,126
So anyway,

1681
00:55:18,126 --> 00:55:19,738
thanks Dana so much.

1682
00:55:19,740 --> 00:55:22,484
Have a great weekend and at this point

1683
00:55:22,484 --> 00:55:25,428
I want to bring into the conversation

1684
00:55:25,428 --> 00:55:28,216
Cara Duckworth, who is the

1685
00:55:28,216 --> 00:55:30,886
Chief Communication Officer for the USPTO.

1686
00:55:30,890 --> 00:55:32,386
Hi, Cara. Hi, Dave.

1687
00:55:32,386 --> 00:55:35,160
Thank you so much, Dave and Dana.

1688
00:55:35,160 --> 00:55:36,712
Wow, what a wonderful

1689
00:55:36,712 --> 00:55:38,264
and enlightening and incredibly

1690
00:55:38,264 --> 00:55:39,040
timely conversation.

1691
00:55:39,040 --> 00:55:39,714
I mean,

1692
00:55:39,714 --> 00:55:42,410
thank you so much for sharing all of

1693
00:55:42,490 --> 00:55:45,250
that wisdom today with our audience.

1694
00:55:45,250 --> 00:55:48,733
What a great way to sail into our weekend.

1695
00:55:48,740 --> 00:55:51,449
Like Dave said, I'm Cara Duckworth,

1696
00:55:51,450 --> 00:55:53,002
I'm Acting Chief Communications

1697
00:55:53,002 --> 00:55:53,778
Officer at the USPTO.

1698
00:55:53,780 --> 00:55:55,808
I'm sure there are many people

1699
00:55:55,808 --> 00:55:59,003
tuned in who did so because of the

1700
00:55:59,003 --> 00:56:00,767
Olympic and Paralympic brand.

1701
00:56:00,770 --> 00:56:03,874
You know exactly what it is, you know

1702
00:56:03,874 --> 00:56:06,226
the Olympic rings, the Paralympic agitos

1703
00:56:06,226 --> 00:56:08,781
and what that stirs in you. We're all

1704
00:56:08,781 --> 00:56:10,888
connected by the excitement we feel

1705
00:56:10,888 --> 00:56:13,268
surrounding the games and I know I

1706
00:56:13,268 --> 00:56:15,575
can remember as a young kid growing

1707
00:56:15,575 --> 00:56:18,479
up glued to the TV with my family.

1708
00:56:18,480 --> 00:56:20,909
Like so many families watching the games,

1709
00:56:20,910 --> 00:56:22,920
cheering on the American team feeling

1710
00:56:22,920 --> 00:56:25,788
such a sense of pride and wonderment.

1711
00:56:25,790 --> 00:56:27,800
I look forward to doing that

1712
00:56:27,800 --> 00:56:30,308
again in July with my family.

1713
00:56:30,310 --> 00:56:32,302
So the US Olympic and Paralympic

1714
00:56:32,302 --> 00:56:34,073
Committee is really a true

1715
00:56:34,073 --> 00:56:35,968
steward of this important brand

1716
00:56:35,970 --> 00:56:38,756
and all of all that it represents.

1717
00:56:38,760 --> 00:56:40,962
There is a lot of value

1718
00:56:40,962 --> 00:56:43,130
in that and brands matter,

1719
00:56:43,130 --> 00:56:43,874
trademarks matter,

1720
00:56:43,874 --> 00:56:46,478
and protecting them as Dana and

1721
00:56:46,478 --> 00:56:49,097
Dave discussed today, matters even more.

1722
00:56:49,100 --> 00:56:52,132
I hope some folks who tuned in today

1723
00:56:52,132 --> 00:56:54,713
are inspired to perhaps create another

1724
00:56:54,713 --> 00:56:57,760
Olympic size brand to earn the trust

1725
00:56:57,760 --> 00:57:00,672
of the public to provide so much value

1726
00:57:00,672 --> 00:57:03,030
to communities the way USOPC does.

1727
00:57:03,030 --> 00:57:05,816
And as Dave mentioned and Steve mentioned,

1728
00:57:05,820 --> 00:57:09,124
USPTO will soon be launching our sports

1729
00:57:09,130 --> 00:57:11,454
and trademarks campaign, so stay tuned for some more

1730
00:57:11,454 --> 00:57:13,218
great information about the importance

1731
00:57:13,218 --> 00:57:15,336
of trademarks in the sports economy.

1732
00:57:15,340 --> 00:57:16,261
Please follow us,

1733
00:57:16,261 --> 00:57:19,140
@USPTO on Twitter, on Instagram,

1734
00:57:19,140 --> 00:57:21,548
on LinkedIn and Facebook for more updates.

1735
00:57:21,550 --> 00:57:23,590
And finally, this year marks the

1736
00:57:23,590 --> 00:57:25,690
75th anniversary of the Lanham Act,

1737
00:57:25,690 --> 00:57:27,814
the primary federal trademark law in

1738
00:57:27,814 --> 00:57:30,609
the United States and we have a few

1739
00:57:30,609 --> 00:57:32,583
upcoming events to mark the celebration,

1740
00:57:32,590 --> 00:57:34,054
including one next week,

1741
00:57:34,054 --> 00:57:35,884
which will feature remarks from

1742
00:57:35,884 --> 00:57:38,110
Dave who you heard from here today,

1743
00:57:38,110 --> 00:57:40,246
as well as Secretary of Commerce

1744
00:57:40,246 --> 00:57:40,958
Gina Raimando and

1745
00:57:40,960 --> 00:57:42,760
Andrew Hirshfeld performing the functions

1746
00:57:42,760 --> 00:57:45,400
and duties of the USPTO director.

1747
00:57:45,400 --> 00:57:47,698
So please visit our website at

1748
00:57:47,698 --> 00:57:49,608
www.uspto.gov and check out our

1749
00:57:49,608 --> 00:57:51,778
public events on our home page.

1750
00:57:51,778 --> 00:57:53,679
And for more information on trademarks

1751
00:57:53,679 --> 00:57:56,500
and how to register a trademark

1752
00:57:56,500 --> 00:57:57,948
and protect your trademark,

1753
00:57:57,948 --> 00:57:59,758
check out the trademark basics

1754
00:57:59,758 --> 00:58:00,939
page of uspto.gov.

1755
00:58:00,940 --> 00:58:04,405
Thanks again and have a wonderful weekend.

1756
00:58:04,410 --> 00:58:06,218
Thanks everyone, thanks Dana.